this post was submitted on 10 Mar 2025
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Well it's not longer in compliance with entry qualifications. So sort out the democracy and gain entrance again.
I'm not sure I understand, because far-right, nationalist and/or fascist governments gain power through democratic elections.
Yes and if they then destroy the democratic institutions (press, judiciary), without which they wouldn't been able to gain entry into the EU, they should be expelled.
With this logic the same should be applied to Italy, Finland, Slovakia, Croatia and the Czech Republic.
Still, this approach doesn't tackle the issue that the far-right gains power through elections in representative democracies.
It's not only the far right gaining power, it's about dissolving the democracy after they gain power. If they don't meddle with the trias politica, and change the way the democracy functions so that they remain in power, it's totally fine.
However Orban did that and therefore deserves a kick.
Fidesz didn't dissolve democracy, they hacked it. I feel the term captured state fits, but they also talk about it being a hybrid regime.
Your concerns are very much grounded, but I just don't see booting HU as a good solution. While there might be merit into 'scaring Hungarians' into getting rid of Orbán and co with a chance of losing EU access, it would only be good as a hail mary. I'd say half his voter base doesn't really care about external (or internal) politics or is convinced that Brussels is the new Moscow.
Let me ask you one thing: is it better to have an ally that is visibly corrupted than to try and support the partizans in a neighbouring Russian vassal?
Valid suggestion. My motivation is based on Orban to veto any major changes that would defend Europe from Russia.
One could also change the need for absolute consensus in the EU but that could also lead to a slippery slope.
My reasoning is that if a country would not qualify for entry in the current state there should be pressure to change things. At least they shouldn't be able to extort the Union like they currently do.
I mean in no way to punish the Hungarian people, but there needs to be some unpacking to be done, I'm not sure if that could happen without external pressure in the current 'hacked' democracy.
While I cannot see any outright solution for our collective Orbán problem, I can definitely say it's a great learning experience in adjusting requirements for newcomers.
We need to attach joining a common public prosecution to list. Something with teeth, that only autocrats need fret (I have no clue what and how, though).
I whole-heartedly agree. I am definitely biased on the matter, but I feel the whole separation direction is antagonistic to the EU cause. Like right now Orbán is definitely antagonistic and causing disruption to the common goal, but if we separate Hungary from the EU, we take away Orbán's tight-rope act and the problem only further festers (albeit, outside the EU).
There is definitely an argument to be had against this, as the EU has acted as a valve for people who were fed up enough. So maybe we can make a pressure cooker, but for some reason I doubt the government will be the first casualty if that happens.
Yeah it's a difficult situation and I might have been a bit populist in my blatant 'throw them out' rethoric. It does feel a bit hopeless sometimes though. I am so glad Poland got out of the PIS stranglehold, though. It's hard to see former Eastern bloc states somehow succumbing to Russian interference.
The slowness of action is both Europes greatest asset as its fundemental weakness. It's relatively shielded from short lived populism, but it can't really react well to when the democracy rots through.
But thanks for this interaction and for justly calling for more nuance. It's not a great time with old creull autocrats seizing the reigns all over.