this post was submitted on 06 Sep 2023
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[–] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 15 points 1 year ago (3 children)

Capitalism isn't trading good for/with currency though. Socialist and Communist societies would still use currency as it is a lot easier than bartering everything. And in Socialists society, you can still have lending and investments.

Capitalism is the means of production and trade owned by private entities (be it a person or a corporation) to make profits.

You are right though, inevitably, capitalism leads to consolidation and monopolies which we see today.

[–] Imotali@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

This "barter" economy as a primary means of exchange never existed. It's a myth and a lie created by capitalists (actually by one Adam Smith) trying to rationalize the adoption of coinage and currency in ancient civilization.

In fact barter economies tend to arise predominantly in capitalism during periods of economic instability. Ie: after natural disasters, in war torn countries, etc.

The proper term you are looking for is "gift economy" and it is how the world worked before capitalism. I want something from you so you gift it to me with the implicit understanding that if in the future the roles are reversed I give something to you of relatively equal perceived value.

It was actually pretty rare that gifts were paid back in full in one transaction and often larger gifts were paid back through a series of transactions.

[–] SCB@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago (1 children)

TIL that during the 16th to 19th centuries the aristocrats benefited from a "gift economy" because no one who ever says this knows what Mercantilism was.

[–] Imotali@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Where did I mention the 16th or 19th centuries? And mercantilism was 100% not a barter economy. It was a form of market economy controlled by the state.... so I'm pretty sure it's you who misunderstands what mercantilism is.

[–] SCB@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago (1 children)

Mercantilism was purely extractive, and thus completely immoral, I agree. However, trade does predate capitalism because capitalism was not a nominal economic system at the time and mercantilist countries traded with one another.

[–] Imotali@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago

Trade is not barter. And if it involved coinage or it isn't barter. It's a form of market economy.

Market Economy ≠ Barter

[–] Hanabie@sh.itjust.works -5 points 1 year ago (2 children)

Trading with currency is the basis for capitalism. Capitalism is lending/investing. When you don't have any actual wares at hand, but currency, virtual value, you trade for higher future virtual value.

[–] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago (1 children)

You could barter cows and still be in a capitalistic society. It just wouldn't be

Currency is just a way to simplify a transaction. I have a cow thatis valued at 100$. I get 100$ that I then spend on whatever. I don't need to trade a cow for a 100 eggs, then keep 10 eggs and trade for butters.

Lending isn't inherently capitalistic. I can lend a 100$ to my friend to start a business and he gives me back a 100$ after a time, no interest.

[–] MrBusinessMan@lemm.ee -1 points 1 year ago

Communism is when the government steals your cows and gives you back the milk as rations.

Capitalism is when you have somebody milk the cow for you and then you sell the milk and get rich and everyone calls you Mr Milkman the Millionaire.

As you can see capitalism is a much preferable system.

[–] zbyte64@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 year ago

Colonial America enters the chat

let me bootstrap our national bank by using slaves a collateral.