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The Windows 11 problem
(www.spacebar.news)
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this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2023
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ITT: People who just read the headlines and not the article, and then going off on their own Windows rant/Linux evangelism instead of discussing the article.
A certified Lemmy/Reddit classic.
I think it’s just an internet classic at this point.
I hardly ever saw Linux evangelism on Reddit. It's honestly becoming about on par with veganism at this point... And that's coming from someone that uses and enjoys Linux.
I was on Reddit for over a decade and it definitely used to have way more Linux evangelism until the site became more mainstream
This. I was on reddit since earlier digg 4.0. the alonux snobs were overwhelming then. Gradually they went into deeper subreddits
damn you're a real OG. And by quite a bit based on those double spaces there (either that or you're a lawyer lol)
I see it more of a response of the dumpster fire that is Windows and Microsoft.
I read the article and I still evangelize Linux.
A someone running a proxmox cluster on my gaming PCs, why not just use all of the above? Hell, I still have an XP VM on there somewhere for some particularly grouchy games.
Don't see a need, basically. What games require XP though? So far all my old games still work on 10.
XP was the last Windows OS that supported 16 bit code if I recall correctly, so there's that. Although most games that needed that are better off with something like DOSbox.
Ah yes, I suppose there's that, and I've been running the really old games on Dosbox too.
I read the article! It suggests in a hundred different ways that Windows 11 sucks and that sticking it out with Windows 10 is a bad idea for a dozen different reasons.
The people here suggesting Linux nailed it. If you're not using Linux at this point you're just being lazy, IMHO. If you have any issues you can always just troubleshoot and fix it but based on the anecdotes posted so far it's obvious no one claiming to have tried Linux has done much of that.
Get off your ass and learn something new for real or stop bitching and bend over for Microsoft with your wallet ready to pay them afterwards for the privilege.
People bitching about Windows on their personal PCs is like people who don't vote bitching about politics.
No, I just want to use my time in other ways, thank you. You can call it lazy, but that's what it is. Windows 10 still works, the issues won't come till 2025, and regardless, Windows 11 issues are mostly personal preferences (I just want my task bar to work in a certain way).
This religious-like evangelising over Linux is such a turn off, regardless of whatever technical merits the OS might have. It's definitely not moving the needle for me, and it's turning me off the fediverse.
Linux has tons of perks! If you don't care, awesome! Have a nice day and enjoy whatever you want.
I don't see how this is a difficult concept for so many haha. Like yeah, you can like something and think it's a better way to do something, but I do LOADS of things the "wrong way". Who cares
That's why the Linux crowd here I describe as evangelical. I'm going to say that even the vegans aren't as annoyingly zealous.
It's just something that people are excited about. It's also mind-boggling how people complain so much about a product but refuse to replace it. Yeah, I get it how there's software that only runs on Windows; this is something that should be fixed. We shouldn't be stuck on a shitty OS with no other options due to required software. That's the thing about Linux, you can customize it to be whatever you want, whereas you're stuck with whatever Microsoft gives you with Windows. Just the idea that a single company has control over everything is wrong. I don't really care if Linux wins out in the end, I just want choice in what OS I can run. That's it.
https://www.startallback.com/
This fixed most my issues with windows 11.
Linux is great but it’s not always an option. It doesn’t run every app or game that Windows has (Proton is great but it’s not 100%), or maybe you’re doing dev work that has to be on a Windows machine, or you’re using some hardware that isn’t supported well in Linux. I switched off Linux to Windows (and then later to macOS) partially because Photoshop and Lightroom are pretty great tools for my job and the workarounds/alternatives weren’t cutting it.
That’s funny cause the last time I told my friend Alex that I couldn’t switch to Windows because it doesn’t run the Linux apps I need, he was like, “well you can use WSL, which can run Linux apps in Windows”. I would describe it the same way, it’s great, but it’s not 100%.
Putting this burden straight on the consumer is stupid. Most people don't care about what's running on their machines and have absolutely no interest in learning it. Same thing with cars, you know how to operate it and that's enough for 95% of the people. I agree that Linux is not that hard to learn and understand but that's already too much for the standard consumer.
The issue is and has always been with Microsoft and the deals it had with OEM and governments. It locked us into a Microsoft only world (office being absolutely everywhere, windows installed by default on 99% of hardware etc.), and things that were unveiled by the Halloween Papers etc.. Microsoft changed its stance on FOSS but it's only because they managed to profit from it (azure mostly). It's still the same garbage company.
Every half a decade or so since windows 95 I have tried Linux and I have come to the same conclusion each time. I rather use windows 95.
If it's not gaming I'm dual booting into Linux as my primary productivity OS. Even then, a lot of the games I play do run perfectly fine under Linux. Been going strong with this since 2015 and I don't have much negative to say about it. Ymmv
Only place it works fine for me is steam deck. Otherwise I just use windows unless I have to service a Linux machine at work.
Sounds like you just love Win 95.
Modern Linux is a boring, just works, OS like any other IME.
Sure I do, its better than linux
I used Linux for over twenty years and stopped about two years ago due to Linux invariably moving to lazy, poor development and design all the way from the kernel up. Rapid kernel development with tons of random new patches and ideas instead of the old way of maintaining a stable kernel and doing random patches and ideas on a separate branch (the odd minor versions vs. the stable even ones, and even the modern "stable" kernels are just the same branch of constantly rapid updated kernels where they just choose one at random and say "this is 'stable' now and we'll keep patching it instead of telling people to install new ones"), systemd being more of a problem than a solution, the push for everything to move to Wayland forcing every single thing that has to do with lower level desktop interfaces, including all of the lightweight window managers, to completely rewrite themselves with tons of bloat that replaces everything X.org did by default as well as Wayland's devs taking a "it works on my computer" approach to bugs and dismissing tons of major issues people have found, pipewire still not being a stable, reliable audio system (Linux has never had one, but using ALSA with the right hardware back in the day where everything would mix via hardware was a decent solution), distros becoming more and more unreliable and buggy (even "stable" and "long term support" ones), distros and developers giving up on native and running bare metal applications and substituting things like flatpak to run things natively with any sort of cross-platform reliability and fucking wine -- essentially a new version of Windows running in Linux, which is an admission of failure to make a successful game platform if I've ever heard one -- to run games, and on and on.
I've been able to use Linux very well until a few years back. I used to be one of its biggest advocates and wouldn't dare run Windows.
No more. People bitch, moan, and complain about Windows 11 so much but for me, it just works. Simply, easily, no problem. Do I wish I still used Linux? Hell, yes. But am I given how bad it's become? Nope. I've even tried going back here and there and quickly ran into the same huge list of problems and aches that were never there before and back to Windows I go.
Sorry, Linux is a pain and it's not about being lazy, it's about wanting to use a decent OS that just works as well as Linux used to.
I’ve been using Linux since 2008, and yours and my experience is basically opposite. I stayed on X until about a year ago, and haven’t had any problems with Wayland. PipeWire was basically immediately better as soon as Fedora switched to it. I could use Jack plugins and patch bays with my pulse apps, including all the electron apps, like Discord. Systemd has always been better than sys5 init. Maybe you don’t remember how bad the old init daemon was.
I’m sorry you had trouble with Linux though.
Ditto here. I always felt that the desktop environments were just way less polished than Windows, but I feel like it's been the reverse now with KDE Plasma for the past couple years. I don't feel like I'm taking a lesser experience for the sake of having control over my computer, at least anymore.
I would actually like if Windows went back to the Windows 7 era of... everything. At least there'd be some competition to Linux. Where it's sitting right now with both Windows 10 and 11, I'd take a lesser experience under Linux if it meant that Microsoft wasn't in charge of everything. It's my computer.
I remember the old initd. It was fast, efficient, didn't hang up for 10+ minutes when it got confused about what needed to shut down when, and just worked until a bunch of impatient new Linux users wanted to get to the desktop in 0.00007 seconds and couldn't patiently wait for a proper init boot order so they created this bloated monstrosity. But those aren't even the worst part of NuLinux: to this day Wayland is absolute unstable garbage not worth using. Visual glitches, UI glitches, instability, slowdowns, and outright crashes that even REISUB can't recover from. Meanwhile, Xorg still Just Works.
Modern Linux is garbage and needs to be either fixed or thrown away.
Considering how many issues you’re having using software I currently use without issue on a huge variety of hardware, I think you’re probably experiencing hardware related issues. Either that or you’re using some configuration that is causing you issues. You might want to start from scratch on a new system and see if you run into the same issues.
Considering what a wide variety of hardware I use and all of it exhibits the same behavior, maybe it's just you who is ignoring obvious issues to push your agenda.