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this post was submitted on 05 Dec 2023
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Death to NATO
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According to the logic applies by the west in past conflicts, Russias SMO isn't illegal. According the Un it is, but so are literally all western wars since WW2.
In fact, it's directly modelled on what NATO did to Yugoslavia where they recognized breakaway regions and then had them invite NATO to help. Russia is just following the standard set by the rules based world order here.
I'm against invading any nation and protested it many times (including the U.S.).. Can you say the same? SMO is just an invasion by a different name.
I think calling it an "SMO" is weird but the invasion was completely justified. I guess I'm a centrist now.
Invading another country is justified? How? Some perceive threat that doesn't exist? That's some American shit you're throwing around
The people of Donbas didn't want to be part of the ethnonationalist project that the country was inducted into by Euromaidan. They tried to find a peaceful way out but none existed, as the Ukrainian government shamelessly strung everyone involved along while continuing its shelling. It became apparent that the shelling would not stop except by either a) capitulation to the Banderite government or b) breaking the back of the Ukrainian military. I think option b) is more reasonable.
You aren't going to get some kind of moral defense of Russia out of me, they are a mafia as far as I'm concerned, but their cynical calculus resulted in them taking the side more worthy of support in this case and, within the scope of this case, they should therfore be supported.
I applaud your argument. It's one of the better ones. They still invaded a sovereign nation (twice), even if some people supported you. I don't see Russia supporting Chechen independence even though some Chechens want independence. Ohhhh.... I see we have to break the back of the Russian military to do that....
Perhaps such a thing should happen, I don't know the actual popularity of the independence movement. Wouldn't want to stumble into another "revolution of our time" where most people oppose it. But I am not aware of Russia bombarding Chenya either, so I think all the Intel is on your side there. Ukraine certainly doesn't seem to respect them, considering the origin of the "Orc" meme . . .
But Russia would have had much weaker justification if it hadn't spent the 8 years prior to the invasion trying to negotiate a peaceful solution to the bombardment which Ukraine, again, handled in a deceitful and destructive manner.
Certainly the Russian military needs to be disassembled eventually, since the Federation is a liberal state and thereby only very circumstantially helpful, but I'd be careful about equivocation in the context of the west and its Banderite dogs.