this post was submitted on 29 Jan 2024
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Funny you should mention that... Did you know that Israel has, on average, killed an equivalent of 9/11 every 10.6 days since October 7th, of which half are children?
Oh, and in terms of numbers, "as bad or worse than 9/11"... if you go by the numbers, it's 766 civilians killed on October 7th vs 2600-3000 on 9/11. So, you're not only off by a factor of 4 there, but you seem clueless how your analogy would look when describing Israels ongoing genocide.
Also, why not just use October 7th as a unit of reference. Israel has done an "October 7th", on average, since then, every 3.2 days. And it's still not a fair comparison, as it's 50% children vs 5%.
Comparing Russia to Israel's scale of war crimes is seriously cutting Israel some undeserved slack, even though it'd be a dumb contest of being the least shitty turd stain on humanity.
In a country that is 36 times smaller than the US. Look at what 9/11 caused psychologically on a societal level in the US, and how it affected the political decisions in the decade after (sadly).
In the end, Hamas did start the current war, and bears the main responsibility for the civilian deaths on both sides during it. At the same time, I loathe the current Israeli government, and do think that there have been war crimes committed in Gaza by the IDF, that need to be investigated. The thing is, the Israeli government can and will be replaced in the next election. The same is not possible for Hamas, who are just as detrimental to a two state solution.
Most people commenting in this thread seem to have it all figured out and have very clear opinions for a conflict that simply is not that easy to solve.
That's... what do you mean by "current war"? The rest of that take is arguably not as clear cut as you think it is. Hamas bears the responsibility for killing 766 civilians. Israel bears the responsibility for killing 30 000 civilians. If you start counting on October 7th, that is. The way you are wording it seems veeeery apologetic of genocide. That it's somehow not the responsibility of those perpetrating it, but instead those who (in your opinion) threw the first rock?
The war of the last 4 months.
The count of 30k deaths in Gaza includes civilians and Hamas fighters (but Hamas doesn't publish these numbers). But you subtract alleged Israeli military/police deaths on October 7th from Hamas' death toll.
I said "main responsibility". Of course Israel still has responsibility for the deaths in Gaza. But people act like Hamas didn't anticipate Israels counterstrike exactly like it unfolded (not that I think that it is a good thing that Israel acted exactly in that way).
There has been an ongoing state of hostility since the colonisation and ethnic cleansing of Palestine by European settlers in 1948.
Poor Palestinians... Their fate is in the hands of the good citizens of Israel. 🙄
Palestinians are capable of voting and can vote Hamas out. Why should they not have an election? Hamas is willing to do it, the Palestinians are willing to do it, and the PA is too. Guess who DOESN'T concent to this?
Just more excuses and justifications for a war meant to genocide them...
Because Hamas doesn't want an election. They are in power. They got rid of Fatah in Gaza. Do you think if there would be a free and open election in Gaza, Israel could have stopped it before October 7th?
At least Hamas stopped throwing their inner-Palestinian opposition off high-rise roofs since 2007, from what I heard. Now you might just mercifully get shot as an "Israeli spy".
I'm all for a free Palestine, but the way there isn't Hamas for gods sake.
The way there is by ending the occupation and allowing Palestinians to vote and be given their right to self determination.
But "Hamas" is such a convenient excuse when the conclusion is always Palestinians not voting and not having the right to vote. There is no need or justification for you to use Hamas as an excuse for this. This is the best chance to get Hamad out: to have them voted out by all-Palestinian elections.
The only side not wanting an election for Palestinians now is Israel, and has always been.
Palestinians deserve better than living on the kindness of the citizens of Israel, their occupiers.
You're all for free Palestine? Then you need to really stand for Palestine and stop the "but Hamas!" rhetoric.
Honestly, I think we are not that far from each other.
Netanyahu propped up Hamas for years exactly because he knew that there wouldn't be a unified Palestinian state as long as they are in charge. That was one of the ways his governments worked against the worked against a two-state solution.
You a wrong in thinking that Hamas is not oppressing Gazans just as much as Israel is though. They are the reason why there hasn't been a democratic election in Gaza since 2006.
I don't think that, though. /:
Agreed otherwise.