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I had a Jolla smart phone, it was pretty great but it also quickly became apparent that the company had no real intention to make Sailfish the Android-compatible, open and privacy-friendly OS I was hoping it'd be. Selling licenses to customers to put the OS on third party hardware really killed it for me.
Kinda surprised they are still around, but I guess knowing the right magical words to whisper to investors is a good enough business strategy. They've done it with blockchain, now it's AI.
Jolla says the phone will sell for €299 (including a 1-year subscription license for Sailfish OS)
Emphasis mine. Mate, just what are you doing? A subscription license of a mobile OS? Wat? They could be working together with Purism, Pine64, PostMarketOS and other software+hardware groups trying to make linux phones popular, but instead they are making some proprietary stuff in their corner. Is it really that difficult to work with other people or what's going on?
They are trying to make money to stay afloat. Postmarketos is a community project so it's not comparable. And neither Purism nor Pine64 seem to be huge commercial successes just like Jolla, though they seem to be doing a bit better.
I have no problem with them making money, far from it. My problem is with how. If their OS didn't require a friggin subscription service, I'd buy their phone. What happens when I don't pay for the next payment cycle? My phone gets shut off? The OS stops working? I'm only limited to making phone calls? Fuck that.
If they need a subscription model for the OS, then maybe it shouldn't stay afloat. Clearly there's no money in this.
i am no fan of the proprietary model here, but i think they disingenuously compare it to the rabbit R1 device.
i love the idea of an local-llm-in-a-box, and they claim to have a working (minimal featureset) model that could be expanded. the rabbit device is a glorified siri
With less glory, BTW.
Yeah nope, Jolla still has some closed source parts, then I'd rather monthly fund a project truly open source, like Mobian or Droidian, and maybe with wider target devices horizons than Sony Experia devices only.
Seems a hard sell to go subscription on such a niche platform. I wish anyone luck that could challenge the Apple/Android duopoly though.
I haven't looked into it. But I suspect that if Linux phones can get Kotlin to run natively, we'll start seeing some of the apps from F-Droid ported over and that will be the turning point.
Kotlin isn't the problem, missing the various Android API's is.
But a Linux distro can go like for like, like what Google did with Java right? So people wouldn't have to recreate apps, just tweak them
It's still a lot of work, for what value compared to an OS based on AOSP?
I feel like, if AOSP was going to be adopted by the Linux community, it would've happened already.
I'm not sure what "the Linux community" really means but I would bet that pure open source Android based on AOSP are more popular than the non-Android Linux mobile OS combined.
Think PinePhone and Librem Phone,
Kotlin targets the JVM right? I think you'd need either a port of the runtime (dalvik?) Or an api translation later a la WINE.
But I don't actually know anything, so don't listen to me. Having a fully Foss phone with support for the android app ecosystem would be wonderful though
Apparently, not necessarily https://kotlinlang.org/docs/native-overview.html#:~:text=Kotlin%2FNative%20supports%20the%20following,Linux
Jolla is still going?
They have been owned by a Russian state-owned telecom corporation for a few years until recent events (Russia currently tries to push Sailfish OS fork as its "russian-made" mobile OS). Original Finnish management has split off to a new independent company with the same name last year, and this looks like their last ditch attempt to continue existing. I don't expect they will last much longer (the reason why they were bought by Russia in the first place was that Jolla failed as a business).
Original Finnish management has split off to a new independent company with the same name last year
Best business move EVER! Now people have to wonder with whom they're doing business. Sorta keeps people on their toes. Way better than coming up with a new brand, making it easier for their five customers. /s
Haha byeee
Listen, if the phone itself can still run a custom Linux, then I'm all for it. Why? Because Microsoft needs some competition in this space, and my hatred for Microsoft dwarves any subscription fee. But, if they now lock it down like any Android handset, then fudge 'em.
Wow, what will they think of next!? A subscription for air? For using my own toilet? I hope this company dies quickly…
I welcome competition in the space even if it is imperfect.
The ai box is 700$ ? Who's gonna buy it? Anyway, If you anyone want to run local llm on their own phone then try 4bit quantized phi-3.
Watching Microsoft begging people to subscribe to the hardware they bought and thinking it is a good idea.
It's a really awesome OS, the UI is one of the slickest and most intuitive gesture based UIs I've ever used. But it's so limited for apps etc. Damn shame, because I enjoyed every minute using it on my Xperia.
A subscription for OS updates? That won't for with most users.
The major advantage of a subscription model is that they don't need most users, just enough to be financially sustainable.
Ultimately [the Jolla Mind2] sounds… a lot less useful than the AI-in-a-device features that companies have been promising for products like the Rabbit R1 or Humane AI Pin.
What the hell? Why would the device with a dedicated NPU and local models be less useful than the piece-of-shit marketing stunts that everyone hates?
The Mind2 looks interesting. It solves the issue of your hardware not supporting the requirements to run the model, by providing hardware, and lets you use your existing smartphone to access it remotely. I am curious how it actually performs.
It might not be a long-term product concept though. All new phones are going to come stock with a lot more than 6 TOPS of AI compute onboard very soon.
People see the term AI and instantly get their backs up. All rational independent thought goes out the window at that point.
Wow, what will they think of next!? A subscription for air? For using my own toilet? I hope this company dies quickly…
I always wondered how they stay afloat with their business model (50 €/$ upfront for lifelong updates ).
Now it looks like they can’t :(
I dislike subscriptions as much as the next guy, but for jolla it seems like a good and honest business model. They don’t have an income stream via App store fees and they won’t sell your data. Keeping the regular security and updates coming constantly burns money that needs to come from somewhere.
I would be happier if I could just purchase update packages for an entire year.
Edit:
The comments under article link to the Q&A, looks like I was to pessimistic:
Copy&pasted for your convenience:
Q: Are you considering keeping one-time-fee (perpetual) Sailfish license available?
A: Yes, we are and also based on the feedback it looks that we keep the option for a Sailfish OS (perpetual) license with fixed fee available for all supported device models. This will be offered next to the subscription model.
Q: I get the point you want to charge a subscription but would rather pay it yearly, will that be possible?
A: Yes, it will be.
Q: Will Sailfish OS and AppSupport continue working if I end my subscription?
A: Yes, we won’t be blocking the use. However, you would not receive releases, upgrades and new features.
Q: Will the Free Trial version continue? Also for newer device models?
A: Yes, we’re committed to continue offering the Free Trial license. Next additions to the Free Trial versions will be for Sony Xperia 10 IV and 10 V.
Q: What’s the plan with Sony Xperia XA2, 10, 10 II and 10 III?
A: They continue working as long as it’s technically feasible to support them. Hopefully we support them still years, like we’re used to, but eventually also those will deserve a retirement plan.
Q: Does this affect someone who already has a phone and a license? Do I need to pay subscription in the new Jolla Community Phone/C2?
A: The subscription model does not affect to one-time-fee (perpetual) licenses. The Jolla Community Phone comes with 12 months subscription included, after (and during) which you can freely choose whether to continue with the subscription model or pay a one-time-fee (perpetual) license.
Q: Accessories, screen protectors, cases?
A: Yes, we also like and need these indeed! Thanks to our partnership with Reeder this is now very feasible and relevant accessories will be added to the shop in due course - stay tuned!)