Gig workers in B.C. to be paid minimum of $20.88 an hour : canada

[+] rozodru@lemmy.ca 19 points 3 months ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

[deleted]

[-] blindsight@beehaw.org 4 points 3 months ago

The new rules aren't even strong enough; the CRA calculates the mileage rate every year, yet BC is letting companies get away with paying about half the CRA rate. Why? Tips should be just that—a tip, not required so they can cover their vehicle costs.

If people can't afford to pay minimum wage + mileage, then they shouldn't get service. Go pick it up yourself, or make a frozen pizza or something. Or take public transit or a (regulated) taxi.

I have some sympathy for those with disabilities who can't drive and need to deal with abysmal public transit wait times, but their disability doesn't trump gig workers' rights to the minimum wage.

[-] mosscap@slrpnk.net 3 points 3 months ago

I mean, if you can afford to pay your workers a living wage, then you can't afford to field that job in the first place.

Getting rid of a company that pays my neighbor poverty wages is better for my community (and therefore for me), than letting said company keep delivering me a service of convenience while my neighbor can't afford to buy food.

[-] ProgrammingSocks@pawb.social 2 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I hope they do. The gig economy is unequivocally horrible for everyone that isn't working as an exec at Uber.

[-] TSG_Asmodeus@lemmy.world 1 points 3 months ago

they’ll close up shop in BC in the near future I bet

Bet accepted.

[-] Nouveau_Burnswick@lemmy.world 13 points 3 months ago

Yay!!

[-] rdyoung@lemmy.world 4 points 3 months ago

It's a start but even if you are guaranteed that amount per hour worked you can still end up making way less after operating expenses unless they are also pushing the companies to reimburse for mileage on top of a min hourly. I drive for a living, uber, etc and I run my own service. When you are self employed in most industries, hourly is actually counter productive to profitability and success.

I would absolutely NOT work this kind of job for as little as $20/hour even if that included mileage reimbursement. If you track your earnings hourly then most days you will have an hour or two where you make like $10/hour or less and then it goes nuts and you clear $100 or more in an hour or two or less sometimes. One of the benefits of being self employed is the various tax benefits depending on the country you live/work in. I'm in the USA where I can deduct 64.5c/mile iirc but if I was getting reimbursed I may not be able to take that deduction which would mean I earn less after taxes. Not to mention the control these companies have over drivers when they are considered employees versus independent.

[-] CanadianCorhen@lemmy.ca 7 points 3 months ago

Starting Sept. 3, anyone who accepts work through these and other gig-based apps, such as ride-hailing and delivery services, must receive $20.88 an hour from the time they accept an assignment to the time it is completed, the province says

The $20.88 figure is 20 per cent higher than B.C.'s minimum wage of $17.40 an hour in order to address the gaps between gigs, the government says. Like the minimum wage, it will be adjusted annually to keep up with inflation.

So, yea, doesnt sound like it includes operating expenses, but thats why its higher than just minimum.

[-] rdyoung@lemmy.world -1 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

And if you look closer at the verbiage and the way they are known to operate, you are highly likely to be "on the clock" for 50 but only paid for 40. Then deduct standard taxes from that and you end up with way less than if you had been smart about things and they paid fairly per mile, etc.

Considering how clueless the lawmakers are here in the states about this stuff (despite best of intentions), I wouldn't expect this arrangement to be any better than being free to cherry pick the best offers, best times to work, etc. The beauty of being IC is being able to say fuck that, not doing that one. What I fear about this is that the gig workers will have to accept bullshit offers to keep their metrics in the right zone so they don't get "fired".

[-] Nouveau_Burnswick@lemmy.world 9 points 3 months ago

You are away this article is about the Canadian province of British Columbia?

[+] rdyoung@lemmy.world -10 points 3 months ago

I am and you apparently aren't aware of just how these companies operate. You also clearly didn't read everything I wrote (or didn't comprehend it).

[-] Nouveau_Burnswick@lemmy.world 10 points 3 months ago

The issue is that your assumptions are based on how USA legal, employment, and tax systems work. These are different in Canada.

I'm not saying that aren't valid points, I'm saying those points don't necessarily apply.

[+] rdyoung@lemmy.world -7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I'm not assuming anything. I'm going on the presumption that they will do what they will do and that politicians are going to be similar regardless of country or tax laws, etc.

It's also clear that as I said, you have no idea how these companies operate. They will find a way to fuck the workers over as much as possible.

As I said and you clearly missed. I'm a so called gig worker except I'm making an actual job out of it. I refuse to do the food deliveries because I can't see how they make any money after the time and mileage invested. I drive uber, empower and I am building my own service. I've also been self employed most of my working life and I know how these companies operate.

If you can prove that Canada is somehow impervious to what they have done everywhere since these companies have existed, I'll move asap. For example, if I'm not mistaken, California has similar laws on the books and I am fairly certain that uber and lyft include tips in the hourly min. They will probably do similar up your way unless your law makers are some how much smarter and tougher than ours and thought through the possible ways they could work this law.

The above said. I'm done here. I'm tired of talking chess while you assume we were going to play chutes and ladders.

[-] Nouveau_Burnswick@lemmy.world 6 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

For example, if I'm not mistaken, California has similar laws on the books and I am fairly certain that uber and lyft include tips in the hourly min. They will probably do similar up your way unless your law makers are some how much smarter and tougher than ours and thought through the possible ways they could work this law.

According to this source

Tips from people receiving the service do not count toward earnings

So that should address that one.

If you allow me to combine:

if I'm not mistaken, California has similar laws on the books

And

I'm going on the presumption that they will do what they will do and that politicians are going to be similar regardless of country or tax laws, etc.

According to this source

"In the middle of an affordability crisis, a ridesharing expense rate that is over 50% higher than the comparable rate in California is unreasonable — and we encourage the government to reconsider the consequences for British Columbians who rely on rideshare and delivery," emailed Keerthana Rang, the Canadian communications lead for Uber.

So I would think the laws must differ if it makes it comparatively 50% more expensive than California (50% expensive to who? Not sure, I'm guessing the companies are explicitly opaque on that)

As for

If you can prove that Canada is somehow impervious to what they have done everywhere since these companies have existed, I'll move asap

No one is impervious, the government could change any day and upend the decision. What I can speak to is the current government, who say things like, according to this source :

At an unrelated news conference Friday, B.C. Premier David Eby said despite complaints, regulations will not change. "These companies can suck it up. They'll be alright,. They'll be fine," he said.

Which shows a bit of commitment from the serving party. And also, beyond this salary minimum (it is a minimum, companies are allowed to pay more) they've promised to action the following items according to this source :

All ride-hailing service and delivery workers will be covered through WorkSafeBC. Companies will be required to see the location and estimated pay for a job before it is accepted. If workers are suspended or deactivated from an app, companies must tell them why. Companies must ensure 100 per cent of the tips paid by customers go directly to the worker responsible for the service. Establish a 35- to 45-cent minimum per-kilometre vehicle allowance to help workers cover expenses.

While BC is the starting point, politicians aren't the champion of this movement, it's UFCW. What union do you belong to?

[-] NateSwift@lemmy.dbzer0.com 9 points 3 months ago

About $15.19 USD

[-] Beaver@lemmy.ca 5 points 3 months ago

Let’s go! They deserve it!

[-] autotldr@lemmings.world 3 points 3 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:

British Columbia has become the first province in Canada to provide a minimum wage and other protections for people who work through gig-based apps like Uber, DoorDash, Skip the Dishes and Lyft, according to B.C.

"Too many workers in this industry are putting in long hours and being paid less than the minimum wage," Janet Routledge, the parliamentary secretary for labour, said in a release.

to hear about their experiences and concerns — and after several gig workers threatened to strike if improvements weren't made.

According to a March report from Statistics Canada, approximately 3.6 per cent of workers between the ages of 15 and 69 took on gig work as their main job.

The announcement was welcomed by UFCW Canada, a private sector union representing Uber drivers across the country.

In a release, the union said it wants every province in Canada to introduce legislation aimed at ensuring rights and protection for people who work using gig-based apps.

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