Yeah, it's maybe the greatest difference between Patriotism and Nationalism: the former is all about "I'll work to make my house the best house" whilst the latter is about "Yield to me, as I am from the best house".

Patriots want their country to be the best country, Nationalist want to extract gains from living in what they think is the best country.

You'll notice that the only things Nationalists ever do for their country are things like "stopping others from coming here" or "celebrating the greatness of their country", which aren't at all about making the country better.

It could be the best for you.

You seem to be implying all people and countries are on a scale moving closer to some single ideal.

But it's perfectly valid to think your house is the best and want it to be different to someone else's house, who also thinks their house is the best.

We need to build a shared culture so that we can work together.

My house will become the best house should be a message we all can get around. Otherwise, why should I work with you to build society?

If you don't like shared work or shared culture to begin with, it's a bit problematic in that your own political ideologies are destined to die. At the very minimum, your ideology must be self sustaining.

Patriotism and nationalism has zero place in society.

That's not true, Bernie Sanders campaign had a wonderfully wholesome and inclusive version of patriotism which they used to great effect:.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nwRiuh1Cug

...and he also talks about his nationalism when deriding the Koch brothers:.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vf-k6qOfXz0

So like most things it depends on when AND HOW they're used.

Patriotism and nationalism has zero place in society.

Not true. Patriotism is wanting and seeking the best for your country. Because our society relies on those physical divides, patriotism would actually improve society. Nationalism is deciding that whatever your country is doing already is the best simply by virtue of self-identification. There is no desire for improvement outside of an individual perception so it, functionally, can never offer any improvement for society.

One is potentially beneficial. The other is cancerous.

Ok so let's entertain the opposite of patriotism and talk about self distane what is going to drive you to fix the crumbling rotting foundation or leaky roof because who cares if this crummy house rots and collapses on me if you don't care about your county then you won't have the drive to maintain it sure some might but those people who don't need motivation to do things are rare and far between if the world is hopeless then what hope is there of fixing it

Yup. The main difference between a patriot and a nationalist - or fascist - is a few years and an opportunity.

Instead of local-level should it not be headed towards planet-level?

also makes you complicit in the division of people by countries and nations, as opposed to classes and other valid groups of people.

I don't think we need to do any division between people.

Patriotism also sucks, because it implements a bias that can then be exploited, and brings very little to the table.

patriotism is a very personal thing, by the very definition of it. You simply cannot apply it outside of yourself. If you are outwardly patriotic. You have already fucked up.

I would argue there is a valid reason to have some form of special relation to your country, your country is simply, not any other existing country. If you live in estonia, you have a fully digital government. If you live in america you have one of the foundational democratic governments of modern society, as well as a particular cultural history (though turbulent, rather remarkable) as well as a particularly unusual geography and land usage. If you live in europe, you live in a moderately to high density populated area, that is highly socialized, and cooperative. Etc. Etc. Etc.

The fundamental problem here is thinking that europe is worse than america, simply because it's different. What you're applying here is a soviet level utilitarian "collective" identity.

Though i agree with the state level patriotism, that's fucking weird, stop doing that.

There’s no “special” reason to view the adults you grew up with as better or worse caretakers. Statistically, it’s likely they’re equivalent to many others.

Still, this over application of logic refuses to let us be enthusiastic about anything unless there’s a scientifically documented reason towards it. It’s nice to have reasons to adore something, even if that thing is a country - but the comic is making the point that you should still want to find flaws in and improve that thing.

imo, actual patriotism would be more like "I want to make my house as good as I can."

You don't have to think your country is the best to be patriotic with respect to that country.

Talk about dumbass takes..