cross-posted from: https://lemmit.online/post/1011094
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The original was posted on /r/aboringdystopia by /u/bisexualbestfriend on 2023-10-04 15:06:06.
this post was submitted on 06 Oct 2023
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im not american so these anti union things are always wild to see, like do these actually work?
Yes
Yes. Most people believe anything if you tell them often enough.
Yes. I hear people shit on unions every now and again, saying the same bs you hear on anti union propaganda.
Thats true, but theirs just as much repeated garbage on the other side. People dont think for themselves anymore.
Other side of what?
Depends on the union. Sometimes they are just there as a mouthpiece for management. Sometimes they fight for worker's rights.
but like, in a country that isnt run by companys as hard as usa, the latter is the default. nothing more nothing less. Are unions so busted in america even they cant help but filled with corruption?
During and still after the Cold war the US used state intelligence and right wing fanatics to break US labor power. The US is a country with low political intelligence and solidarity because of it.
It depends on the industry and honestly I'd be surprised if some unions in your country are not similar or worse. I'm in Chicago, which is one of the country's biggest union strongholds, and construction unions here are often shitty and corrupt. Unions will bully and fight dirty against competing companies, sometimes even getting in spats between local chapters
if such a thing is present in my countries unions is so minuscule that its inconsequential, but if fairly confident (no country is perfect but you get my point) my countries isnt even close to whatever hellhole usa unions are
Might be a difference in the role the union has fallen into. The unions I'm talking about have been given way too much power through cronyism over the years, and at this point act more like a trade association/cartel acting for the businesses against other businesses, not for the workers against management
See cronyism isjt even possible and very much not allowed in mine and some other countries (can't speak for everyone of course) And unions as again, other countries as well only have as much power as workers choosing then, no workers? No power Majority of workers use them? Now they finally have the weight they need
That's what I imagine and hope is the default outside america, or at least it should be
Yeah my American brain has trouble comprehending a system where cronyism isn't possible. Here most unions have an associated PAC and are very active with political donations and lobbying
That place doesnt exist. There are cronys everywhere. Youre falling victim to socialist propaganda where "Everybody is equal", thats bullshit. Every country on the planet has super huge rich companies, billionaires that have connections, bribes and payoffs.
No different than the " free" healthcare fallacy. Just because its not itemized, peolple convince themselves by they didn't pay for it. Thats what theyre doing, thats how all the anticapitalist bullshit happens, which is hilarious when its a Union doing it, since hard work paying off and being able to further yourself as a result of that literally being what capitalism is all about.
What union doesn't elect their union leadership?
Well some stewards are prone to bribing, special treatment by MGMT to turn a blind eye to certain things or back off. Others are competent, but maybe too busy for you. Others are elected because they're popular or whatever, but as a steward they're not knowledgeable or brave or effective. There's lots of ways a union steward can go awry.
And lots of ways that a union steward can go right?
It tends to be an overall, net positive.
these probably don't change any minds, but unions in general have been so stigmatized they they're probably reinforcing the views of a fair number of people.