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About 100,000 turn out in London for pro-Palestine rally
(www.theguardian.com)
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this post was submitted on 21 Oct 2023
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I don't think any right-thinking person has any sympathy for Hamas, and rightly so.
However, Palestinians are not automatically members of Hamas. This would be like saying you're "done with" Americans and we should bomb every major American city because of the actions of the Proud Boys and other right-wing militias.
The support for hamas is 57% in palestine, Islamic Jihad has 71% support, people with Palestinian background are celebrating the executions, the rapes, and the murder of children on the streets in the western world even.
A more reasonable comparison would be to feel completely done with USA because of the republicans or democrats, but not even that compares since the support of both parties actually are lower than that of Hamas or Islamic Jihad in Palestine
Just a few things thats come up in Sweden in "support of palestine" after the 7th october attack.
Hizb Ut-Tahrir flags, terrorists that are radical islamists, banned in 6 + almost all Arab countries. Their goal is to create a Muslim caliphate by fights against their idea of non-muslim regimes. They recognize no other religion, is heavily anti-semitic, and is founded in Jerusalem
The biggest arabic newspaper in Sweden had 2 editors show open support for Hamas- quote: "may god assist them and give them victory" and "our guys are good" just hours after the attack.
Big number of cars driving up and down the streets honking and waving flags hours after the terrorist attack. In the comments people are discussing how big this demonstration was, and how several streets were completely shut off, aswell as some Danish commenters explaining how it was the same in Copenhagen.
Article about the demonstrations aswell as the support shown online to these terrorist attacks. This one isn't as credible as the rest since it's a very right-wing website, but the demonstrations are true and the comments they mention were on full display in support of Hamas murdering jews.
Here's our government discussing entirely stopping all financial and humanitarian aid to Palestine because of the huge support shown for the murders, kidnappings, and tortures that were committed the 7th. Quote: "We cannot provide support for a government that celebrates and shows support for actions like these"
The most important part of this is the support level. I have 2 points about this. First is that 43% of Palestinians in Gaza that don't support Hamas are entitled to not be blown up or displaced, the second is that out of those 57% there's a big difference between material support and just ticking a box in a poll. Does someone who says "Hitler did nothing wrong" deserve execution? I would argue they should be deplatformed, but not starved, tortured, shot and/or bombed.
And to add to that, these people did not say "Hamas did nothing wrong". 58% said they saw Hamas as very or "somewhat" positive. This is an organisation who on one hand is a terrorist organisation, but who on the other hand operates social services. People living in deep poverty who are exposed to the social services aspect will naturally to some extent be willing to tick a box saying "somewhat positive" (38%, vs 20% "very positive") for an organization who they personally have first-hand positive interactions with.
Despite that, and at the same time, the same survey also points out that 70% of the population in Gaza wants Hamas to give up separate armed units and hand power over the the Palestinian Authority, which should give some insight into how "somewhat positive" does not mean "agree with brutal terrorism against civilians" given that it in fact doesn't even mean "thinks Hamas should stay in charge or have control of armed units".
This person keeps grossly misrepresenting the level of support actually expressed.
Of course nobody ever deserves to get bombed, just the same as how nobody deserves what Hamas did to the Israelian civilians. My point is to address how disgusting and despicable the behavior of Palestinians are regarding the actions of Hamas, and how ridiculous it is that these behaviors aren't getting called out.
Instead of worldwide demonstrations against israel and celebrations of what those poor civilians had to endure, perhaps it's time for them to start demonstrating against Hamas. It's really hard to feel any major sympathy when they show absolutely none towards the victims of the terrorist attack.
I wonder how many say they support Hamas out if fear of retaliation.
Why anyone is taking sides in this is just beyond me. They're all literally terrible, both Hamas and the Israeli government.
It's just Iraq all over again
I completely agree. Everyone wants a nice simple goodie vs baddie dynamic but that's just not how it is.
Innocent people are being killed. I am pro-non-combatants-not-dying.
Frankly it's bizarre that western countries are so supportive of Israel. Yes Israel needs to defend itself but I don't think that requires the deaths of 5,000 mostly innocent Palestinians.
A radical idea: if "defending yourself" requires killing thousands of Innocent people, you do not, in fact, have a right to "defend yourself".
I'm greatly worried the whole debacle is taking away much-needed attention from Ukraine.
Maybe. It seems like the same parties pulling the strings in the Ukraine / Russia Conflict are the parties pulling the strings in the Israel / Gaza conflict.
Remember how in the book 1984, it explains how the three major factions of that world were fighting proxy wars in the small equatorial region they had yet to conquer, and they were doing it on purpose to burn resources to maintain their brutally authoritarian societies?
I feel like these wars are doing just that.
Oh definitely, agreed. I'm not siding with israel at all, I'm calling out how absolutely disgusting it is that people are coming to defense of these actions, and defending the worldspread celebrations of these deeds by the people who emigrated away from there.
That's my position too. How can you celebrate in the street after a terrorist attacks like this ?
People will support anyone who fights their oppressors, whether the means used are moral or not. Since oppression and killing are immoral as well.
"We will fight with our oppressor using terrorism, which will guarantee us all further suffering and isolation. We will also fire unreliable missiles that sometimes kill our citizens. Support us!"
Yeah, I don't think it's okay to expect any sane person to support these guys.
What I do not understand is why the same doesn't count for Israel? It's founded by and for people who were oppressed and killed for much longer than Palestinians.
Holy shit, way to misrepresent an article. I urge anyone who thinks the above commenter had a good point to click through and at least read the headline of the article.
Oh no, it's the consequences of my own actions again.