this post was submitted on 25 Oct 2023
60 points (100.0% liked)

askchapo

22767 readers
403 users here now

Ask Hexbear is the place to ask and answer ~~thought-provoking~~ questions.

Rules:

  1. Posts must ask a question.

  2. If the question asked is serious, answer seriously.

  3. Questions where you want to learn more about socialism are allowed, but questions in bad faith are not.

  4. Try !feedback@hexbear.net if you're having questions about regarding moderation, site policy, the site itself, development, volunteering or the mod team.

founded 4 years ago
MODERATORS
 

Both Ukraine and Palestine are fighting against an invading force. We can unanimously agree that Palestinians have have been illegally occupied in an open air prison/concentration camp for 75 years. And we seem to agree that Palestine cannot be a perfect victim and it is reasonable that they seek support in Hamas instead of their Israeli oppressors.

Now why can't the same logic be applied to Ukraine? There is absolutely a nazi problem in Ukraine. A nazi problem that needs to be wiped out. But Russia isnt trying to denazify Ukraine, they're trying to maintain borders and resist NATO. But while doing so they are indiscriminately killing civilians and are the aggressors.

Personally, I believe in what Norman Finkelstein has to say about Hezbollah and the red army. Both are not perfect, but I don't care about their politics. I care that they are a resisting force and believe a country should have the right to self determination.

So how are these situations diametrically opposed that you seem to be hostile towards Ukraine but supportive of Palestine?

I don't mean to come off as shaming or judgemental. I genuinely would like to hear your perspective.

Edit: I appreciate all of the thoughtful and patient responses. Even though I might not respond to everything here I am reading all of it. I was operating under a lack of information, which I've never seen any Western media source report on. Ever since leaving reddit, hexbear has been a great source of alternative perspectives and context. It's opened my eyes to a lot of how I've been misled by papers that I've trusted.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[–] iie@hexbear.net 9 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I can see the response to this being:

"I don't care that America wants to destroy Russia, Russia is bad and should be destroyed."

My response is that multipolarity matters. Multipolarity weakens colonialism and protects real people

Imagine you are a poor nation in the global south — say, Niger — and you want to escape from under the imperial boot without suffering the same fate as Libya, bombed back to the stone age and plunged into an unspeakable humanitarian crisis. When Russia, the only nation willing and able to protect you, offers you a hand, you don't give a shit what Russia's motives are.

Russia — however cynical, however capitalist — does provide a service to the global south. Because western capital threatens Russian capital, Russia resists western capital, and in the process often helps defend global south countries from subjugation. Niger, the second poorest nation on earth despite being rich in resources, just overthrew their French colonial puppet government this summer, and now, to avoid military intervention, they are appealing to Russia for security partnership. Without Russian backing, they're probably fucked.

If you're not a western chauvinist then you give a shit about this. If all your lesser-evil support for liberal politicians comes from a genuine place, then the more you study what's happening in the world the more you'll find yourself lesser-eviling Russia. This is what has happened on hexbear. None of us like Putin or the Russian government, but we see the trolley problem.