this post was submitted on 22 Feb 2024
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[–] deweydecibel@lemmy.world 199 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (21 children)

There's a clip from The Batman ( the animated show) I can't find at the moment, but it basically involves Batman clearing a room of thugs by offering them jobs. They all walk out, without a punch thrown.

In the real world, no one that has Bruce Wayne's degree of wealth is a truly positive influence on the world on the whole. There are no ethical billionaires. But within the context of the DC Universe, Bruce has been routinely demonstrated as using his wealth in the most socially conscious, progressive, and generous ways. He is always shown in stark contrast with the likes of Lex Luthor.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 58 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Bruce has been routinely demonstrated as using his wealth in the most socially conscious, progressive, and generous ways. He is always shown in stark contrast with the likes of Lex Luthor.

Depends heavily on the author.

In "Kingdom Come", for instance, Wayne and Luthor are partners and Wayne's main contribution to Gotham is a fully automated dragnet of police-robots across a city he effectively owns lock-stock-and-barrel.

In "Batman 2099", he's a recluse whose personal tragedies have rendered him incapable of engaging in more than self-pity, while his board of directors does all sorts of evil shit completely off the leash.

In Joaquin Phoenix's "Joker", his family is just another one of the members of the criminal cartel that has corrupted the city, with Bruce's doctor-father spending more time hob-nobbing with the elite socialites than attending to the city collapsing under his feet.

There are definitely more utopian takes on Bruce and his family. But Gotham is inherently dystopian, and you can't escape how the city's wealthiest family is - at least somewhat - responsible.

[–] OscarRobin@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago (2 children)

I think it's awesome that different Batman stories can examine different versions of Bruce and his position as a billionaire - it allows different aspects of the world to be interrogated: criminals sometimes doing crime because they know of no other way to survive in a capitalist hellscape, the apathies of billionaires to the evils of their financiers, Batman's obsession with order leasing him to militarise the streets of the city he loves, etc.

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

Read Legends of the Dark Knight #0. You might enjoy it.

[–] orrk@lemmy.world 1 points 9 months ago

an order obsessed capitalist militarizing to taking over society...

So, batman's fascist arc? on the other hand, Libertarians have always been one step from fascism ironically

[–] azertyfun@sh.itjust.works 43 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (31 children)

Of course he does.

The point is that Batman is the archetype of a right-wing superhero. Batman is how rightwingers understand social justice: accumulate as much wealth as you can, use crushing physical violence to punish bad guys, act charitably at an individual level but do not ever work to solve social issues at a systemic level.
Even in-universe he's nowhere near as much of a positive force as he could be if he used his money to force political and social change instead of as an outlet for his mental issues.

He's not actively villainous because right-wingers don't see themselves as such. But when that fantasy meets reality, you get Elon Musk.

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[–] jaybone@lemmy.world 19 points 10 months ago

Stark contrast… you could have done something with that.

[–] Son_of_dad@lemmy.world 18 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

Still goes around beating people without trial. Reminds me of the comic run where all these low level criminals who Batman has crippled and left for dead for small offences, come after him for revenge since he fucked them up for life, while letting the Joker escape or go to Arkham yet again

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It is a valid point. You can't really walk off a metal batarang hitting you even in the comics where he hits the gun out of their hand. You could easily imagine having lifelong problems with your hand from that.

[–] Son_of_dad@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago (2 children)

One guy has a batarang imprint on his face, which causes him to become a pariah and not be able to get work after getting out of prison, so he blames Batman.

[–] discostjohn@programming.dev 2 points 10 months ago

Well he shouldn't have been a superstitious cowardly criminal

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 1 points 10 months ago

Oh like the Phantom with his emoticon imprints

[–] Anticorp@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

In the real world, no one that has Bruce Wayne's degree of wealth is a truly positive influence on the world on the whole.

Bill Gates almost completely eradicated polio, contributed seriously towards the eradication of malaria, and is addressing the AIDS epidemic in Africa. He and Buffet have been working on a micro-reactor energy project for several years now.

[–] Laticauda@lemmy.ca 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)

He's also done a lot of wide-spread horrible things to get that money though, that's the thing, the good stuff billionaires do rarely makes up for the stuff they've done to get that money in the first place. The most fantastical thing about Batman is that he and his parents are usually depicted at face value as good rich people who get their money legitimately without hurting anyone and then only do good things with that money. And despite that Gotham is still an eternally crime-ridden cess pit. Most billionaires donate huge amounts to non-profits or start their own. Hell I bet trump himself has done plenty of philanthropy, but that automatically doesn't make up for the way they earned their blood money in the first place. Is Bill Gates going out of his way to lobby for taxing the rich, or universal healthcare, or other systemic changes that would help a lot of people but likely reduce the rate he accumulates wealth? Because he has more than enough money to make large waves in those political arenas and still be rich for the rest of his life. If he never made another cent and gave away 90% of his money to homeless people he would still have enough left to be rich for the rest of his life.

[–] Anticorp@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago

That's true. He was a ruthless businessman while running Microsoft, and hurt a lot of people, and the industry as a whole.

Hell I bet trump himself has done plenty of philanthropy

I seriously doubt that. Every one of his charities that I've heard of was actually a fraudulent grift. He stole from cancer patients! I'd be seriously shocked to learn that he's done a single charitable thing in his life that didn't directly benefit him.

Is Bill Gates going out of his way to lobby for taxing the rich

No, but he has stated that he thinks he and his peers should be taxed a lot higher than they are.

Idk if Gate's overall influence balances towards the negative or positive, but I do recognize that he has done some seriously positive things for the world after accumulating his wealth.

[–] VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Bruce also didn't do all the scummy things people typically have to do to become that rich. He inherited his wealth and there's so much of it that it's self perpetuating. He could sell his company, give 99% of his money away, and still have enough to live comfortably on just the interest it generates.

[–] Bondrewd@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

There are no ethical billionaires.

Oh, to the extent everyone else can be they are. Which is very little.

[–] BaldManGoomba@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

Couldn't he use his batman persona to intimidate the rich to affect social change? Like Bruce Wayne can do so much if he had a dude in the night breaking into other billionaires houses in Gotham and telling them to raise wages or stop influencing politicians to not raise taxes and let healthcare for all go through

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