this post was submitted on 25 Feb 2024
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• Concerns rise as Neuralink fails to provide evidence of brain implant success, raising safety and transparency questions.

• Controversy surrounds Neuralink's lack of data on surgical capabilities and alarming treatment of monkeys with brain implants.

• While Neuralink touts achievements, experts question true innovation and highlight developments in other brain implant projects.

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[–] Everythingispenguins@lemmy.world 78 points 10 months ago (9 children)

I really wonder about the Doctors associated with this. How are they squaring things with their Hippocratic oath? This just seems really close to the ethical line, maybe over it. Nothing about how musk is treating this surprises me. But is everyone working on this also an unethical twat? Kind of scary to think that might be true.

[–] Glitchington@lemmy.world 52 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (2 children)

In 1973 the U.S. Supreme Court rejected the Hippocratic Oath saying it didn't cover the latest developments in medical practice.

I'm just... gonna go scream into a pillow in the corner now.

[–] thbb@kbin.social 29 points 10 months ago (1 children)

The Helsinki declaration https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_Helsinki

Is the reference for health sciences these days.

[–] Glitchington@lemmy.world 14 points 10 months ago

This appears to be more geared towards experimentation. Super interesting and more relevant to the article for sure though!

[–] SimpleMachine@lemmy.world 38 points 10 months ago (2 children)

The Hippocratic Oath is not a legally binding oath, and many doctors are not required to take this oath or any oath for that matter. Basically, at the end of the day, oaths only matter to the people who have the strength of character to hold to them no matter the cost and most people do not have that strength of character. Oaths mean nothing to those people when it comes down to it, it's just a thing that you said once, nothing more.

[–] Everythingispenguins@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

Oh I know all that, but still...

[–] valkyre09@lemmy.world 3 points 10 months ago

Can’t wait to see the medical drama where one doctor says “you took an oath, god dammt!” And for the other to reply “nope”

[–] cley_faye@lemmy.world 22 points 10 months ago (1 children)

There are way less extreme example of doctors just fucking things up for a bag of money.

[–] SkippingRelax@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

And more in general, humans. Imagine if Clarence Thomas had taken medicine instead of law when he was young

[–] Roflmasterbigpimp@lemmy.world 17 points 10 months ago

But is everyone working on this also an unethical twat? Kind of scary to think that might be true

People with the Power to do cruel things always find cruel people to do their bidding. Especially when they can justify it with science or it's "for the better of humanity". Even if every rational out stander is horrified by their doings.

[–] BreakDecks@lemmy.ml 6 points 10 months ago

Ethics only matters when there's an effort to enforce it. The Hippocratic oath is just a reason your employer can fire you for making risky decisions. It means nothing if nobody holds you to it.

If you're a doctor working for Neuralink, nobody will expect anything of you but to push the project forward as quickly as possible. For years you only work with monkeys, and when they do finally put a human in the O.R. it's someone who signed away all their rights and accepted all risks to install experimental brain chips. At that moment, that human patient becomes the single most important subject in the entire experiment.

Of course you do it. You're getting paid more money than you ever have in your life to do it, and the entire system is designed to protect you so long as you do what the boss says.

[–] ipkpjersi@lemmy.ml 6 points 10 months ago

I wouldn't be surprised if there somehow were a cover-up of safety and efficacy of these devices.

[–] z00s@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

People are still people. Doctors are just as susceptible to compromising their ethics as everyone else, the only difference is that they probably have a higher bribe threshold.

[–] Scubus@sh.itjust.works 1 points 10 months ago

Well, it's possible that it was a robot doctor, kinda doubt they took a Hippocratic oath