So, to address your question, raw materials only come from nodes, which require miners. Obviously miners require power, but produce raw materials (output via a belt) indefinitely. The rate of extraction depends on the quality/purity of the node (poor/normal/pure) and the level of the miner. Miners can be placed anywhere there is a node. So building smaller modular factories is definitely possible and one of many legitimate strategies.

I think that answers the question, let me know if I misunderstood. I'm not 100% familiar with all the factorio mechanics so I'm not totally sure if I fully understood the question.

Between locations, you can move materials by truck, train, or drone. You can run trucks across the ground or build roads.

When it comes to generation, coal plants can burn just about anything solid, from raw coal to more complex materials derived from by-products of oil production. Fuel generators take any liquid fuel, from regular fuel, turbo fuel, and even liquid biofuel. Additionally there's a bunch of different ways to arrive at each type of fuel, for solids, you can use refineries to refine coal or petroleum waste into compacted coal or similar, and with liquid fuel, there's blenders and refineries, recipes for turbo blend fuel, heavy fuel, even turbo heavy fuel, diluted fuel, and packaged fuel too (used for jetpacks and vehicles). It gets.... Complicated.

With satisfactory, you can build small and just wait, or build big and use a lot of power, and things get finished much faster.

With progression, there's two main sections, milestones and phases. Each phase unlocks more tiers of milestones, and each milestone unlocks more buildables which will allow you to complete future milestones and phases. You can complete them in whatever order you want, but some of the progression requires that certain milestones get completed before progress can be made. In that way, there's some linearity with the progression.

The first person perspective of the game and the three dimensional design is what draws me towards satisfactory more than factorio. I'd happily give you a personal tour of one of the multiplayer servers I play on and host. No pressure, I just thought I'd offer in case you wanted to ask questions and get shown around the game by someone.

It just seems like you would enjoy the game. If you ultimately decide to play, that's fine, if not, no worries.

[–] KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

So, to address your question, raw materials only come from nodes, which require miners. Obviously miners require power, but produce raw materials (output via a belt) indefinitely. The rate of extraction depends on the quality/purity of the node (poor/normal/pure) and the level of the miner. Miners can be placed anywhere there is a node. So building smaller modular factories is definitely possible and one of many legitimate strategies.

i have a rough understanding of this part, my question was more so "do i have to cart a billion thingamajigs from point A to B in order to build a thing" It's already a thing in factorio, so it wouldn't be a deal breaker, but i feel like satisfactory is the type of game to make this a non problem.

Between locations, you can move materials by truck, train, or drone. You can run trucks across the ground or build roads.

similar to factorio, though factorio is more restricted, which i like. There are four directions (8 if you include diagonal rails) and there are explicit tiles that machines and belts take up, which often means you can make super braindead blueprints.

For example, earlier today, i just shit out a blueprint book with a bunch of perfectly tiling walls, where everything aligns perfectly, all based on absolute positioning, so i can easily plonk them down anywhere, and know that i can make my walls line up as needed without having to think about it, along with that i made a roboport blueprint that coincides on the half grid of the wall prints. So that i can print it down inside of the wall without it being in the way, while still having it align perfectly and be super clean.

I imagine you can do similar things in satisfactory, but i suppose this is probably my minecraft roots coming out to play with this one. I'm sure the 3rd dimension and less restriction would be fun, is there any sort of grid alignment? Or is everything manual, i think that would be the one big thing i'd miss, is the ability to align things automatically.

When it comes to generation, coal plants can burn just about anything solid, from raw coal to more complex materials derived from by-products of oil production. Fuel generators take any liquid fuel, from regular fuel, turbo fuel, and even liquid biofuel. Additionally there’s a bunch of different ways to arrive at each type of fuel, for solids, you can use refineries to refine coal or petroleum waste into compacted coal or similar, and with liquid fuel, there’s blenders and refineries, recipes for turbo blend fuel, heavy fuel, even turbo heavy fuel, diluted fuel, and packaged fuel too (used for jetpacks and vehicles). It gets… Complicated.

sounds about right. I'd definitely enjoy that if i got into it.

The first person perspective of the game and the three dimensional design is what draws me towards satisfactory more than factorio. I’d happily give you a personal tour of one of the multiplayer servers I play on and host. No pressure, I just thought I’d offer in case you wanted to ask questions and get shown around the game by someone.

it's definitely interesting, but the thing about factorio that makes me really like it, is that the game seems to be explicitly designed around being a factory builder, where as something like satisfactory is more a 3d open world sandbox game that is also a factory builder, but then again i also havent played it so.

If i ever do buy the game i probably won't take you up on the offer because i'll be too busy figuring the game out already, lol.

[–] MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca 1 points 4 months ago (1 children)

For grids, there is a "world grid" which players were given access to some time ago, if you build properly on the world grid, then when you meet up one section from a factory to another section from another factory, they'll meet properly.

I always use the world grid to get a starting point before laying anything down. I don't want to struggle later on trying to make things fit, and doing it this way it's a no brainer.

For rail lines, they're completely dynamic, if you want to build it into a pretzel, you can do that. I'm not sure the trains would love it, but you can easily do that. There's actually a problem most new players have that after going around a corner, their rail line goes all wavy because the rail curves a little bit depending on where you place it, and what it's attached to. The solution is, at the end of the curve, when you have your ending point, remove the last section of rail at the curve, then build a perfectly straight section of rail where it will continue, then rebuild the last bit of the curve. This ensures the next section will start perfectly straight and any curve in the rail will be isolated to where the rail is meant to be curved. Then continue building as normal and the rest of the line will be straight.

Of course the rail lines can go up/down as much as you want (within the bounds of the world), so it's not uncommon to see sky bridges with long rail lines that span most of the map. In that configuration, either very tall conveyor lifts being materials up/down from stations on the line, or there's long, looped spirals of track to bring trains down to stations. I've seen both, and both methods are valid.

There will be train and truck stations frequently above or below factories for transit. I've also seen long bridges of conveyor belts bringing materials from one place to another. The main benefits to conveyors over trains/trucks/drones is that they're very consistent and don't require any additional power or fuel to run (trucks need fuel, trains use power), but a lot of people think they're ugly, so trains or trucks are common. I'm more of a fan of consistency so I tend to do conveyors, but I don't fault anyone for making different choices. Trains always need infrastructure, at least a rail line, trucks usually need some kind of infrastructure, though, not always. Drones don't need any, so if you want to preserve nature in the game, you can go that way, but drones are very late-game and require batteries which are difficult to build in sufficient quantities. Not impossible, but not easy either.

I tend to build a road with conveyors hanging underneath. The road is for me to get there and to provide the necessary structure to place the conveyors.

One thing I've heard of that factorio has that satisfactory lacks is the idea of pollution. In satisfactory, you can spew all the toxic gases you want and the environment doesn't change at all. Plants still grow and the world keeps looking the same. IDK, it's a difference I know about.

The first-person style of satisfactory is more like building in Minecraft (I would assume) so getting things lined up is sometimes a challenge until you get to the hoverpack. But the hoverpack requires power, and to get it, you have to be within a certain proximity to a power post.

In any case. I was thinking the tour would be a "before you buy" kind of thing, maybe over discord or something, where I can stream my game and you can ask whatever questions you want, and I can show you the mechanics. If you're not interested, that's fine. There's plenty of that kind of tour content on YouTube too if you want to look around.

For transporting materials, you don't have to. If you build modular factories right next to where your nodes are you can produce your items and store them at that location. The only down side is that when you need that stuff you'll have to go to that location and pick up what you need. A lot of players like to build a resource hub and dump all their finished products into bins there, so they have a single location to go to when building anything. Just pick up whatever mats you need, and head out.

I have a lot more I could say about the nuances of design and structure in such a place, but it's all up to the person playing for what they want to do to put it all together. I tend to keep cramming too much into too small of a space and I have to engineer my way around the limitations. I need to plan better.

Anyways, I hope you enjoy factorio, as I enjoy satisfactory. My offer stands if you change your mind. If you ever buy the game and want to play some mp, let me know, I usually have a server running.

[–] KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 4 months ago

There will be train and truck stations frequently above or below factories for transit. I’ve also seen long bridges of conveyor belts bringing materials from one place to another. The main benefits to conveyors over trains/trucks/drones is that they’re very consistent and don’t require any additional power or fuel to run (trucks need fuel, trains use power), but a lot of people think they’re ugly, so trains or trucks are common. I’m more of a fan of consistency so I tend to do conveyors, but I don’t fault anyone for making different choices. Trains always need infrastructure, at least a rail line, trucks usually need some kind of infrastructure, though, not always. Drones don’t need any, so if you want to preserve nature in the game, you can go that way, but drones are very late-game and require batteries which are difficult to build in sufficient quantities. Not impossible, but not easy either.

This is actually kind of interesting to me, because in factorio belts are an option, you can certainly use them, but they are almost definitely more annoying (or atleast more strict) than using trains or bots, you get access to bots just after trains, though you don't get logistics until end game science (so you can compare them pretty closely to drones, though the batteries are fairly cheap)

also, one thing that i've seen in satisfactory is all the little "tidbits" that you have to sometimes do, you mentioned it with the curved rails for trains, that kind of stuff is why i really like factorio, because it has almost none of that. Rails are a little funky sometimes, but there are only straight rails and curved rails, so it's only going to be so wrong. Super fiddly stuff is something i often find really annoying though. I assume a lot of that stuff will either, eventually be fixed, or is not a significant problem since you can just play the game around it and ignore it most of the time.

There are no vehicles, unless you play with AAI vehicles or something, so those aren't an option, but generally rails are a literal "paste and place" type building option, you can plonk shit down wherever, as long as you're connected to your rail network and have those materials on the rail line, it will service what you want.

One thing I’ve heard of that factorio has that satisfactory lacks is the idea of pollution. In satisfactory, you can spew all the toxic gases you want and the environment doesn’t change at all. Plants still grow and the world keeps looking the same. IDK, it’s a difference I know about.

yeah, it's pretty minor, and there are things like efficiency modules which actually counteract about 80% of your pollution when used properly (as well as power consumption, though it's not usually causing pollution, because of solar and nuclear power) Really pollution is just meant to make the biters angry so they attack you, their attacks are actually a function of how much pollution they consume, as well as their evolution. Which has a handful of stages in increasing orders of magnitude, though it does also damage trees, trees will absorb a set amount of pollution continually, and regularly, however if you go above that, you will damage the trees, and the trees will no longer be capable of absorbing as much pollution, leading to more biter attacks, more than likely. Usually trees get in the way more than anything, and it's also worth noting that ground tiles also absorb pollution, grass does quite a bit, sand does less, landfill does none, but nuclear "tiles" (ones that were hit with an atomic bomb) will absorb very little pollution, which is a way of making landfill absorb pollution. Water absorbs very little as well, biters tend to path around water alot, unless you landfill it or something.

You can also just turn it off, if you want, as with most things in factorio, the world is very configurable, since it's all procedural.

In any case. I was thinking the tour would be a “before you buy” kind of thing, maybe over discord or something, where I can stream my game and you can ask whatever questions you want, and I can show you the mechanics. If you’re not interested, that’s fine. There’s plenty of that kind of tour content on YouTube too if you want to look around.

ah i see, i probably won't take you up on it then, it's a factory builder, so i can only hate it so little after all.

Anyways, I hope you enjoy factorio, as I enjoy satisfactory.

absolutely, same to you, i've been working on getting a proper megabase setup, i currently have 120spm, and i'm fixing more for something like, 500SPM now. So i need a considerable jump in resources and production, which is what im working on setting up right now.