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For context: I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD and I somehow need to get an app on there that only has a flatpak release
People bitching about Flatpaks don't understand that they have dedupe built in. You're literally not using any more space and it's easier for app developers to deploy.
Try using Snaps sometime, if you want something to actually bitch about.
No problem, just makr sure your system has the exact version of libraries the application needs. And oh, you will only update those dependencies when the application update updates the requirements.
Oh what's that? Another application you want to install uses the same lib but different version? Tough luck, chump!
Seriously it's either flatpaks or the multi-version dependency management that openSUSE has, and you're not saving much more space here either.
Flatpaks implement deduping, so they actually don't take that much space when installed.
I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD
I think I found your real problem.
8GB SSD
Thereβs your problem. The last time 8GB was plenty was in 1998.
Yup. Those 64 GB SSDs many retailers put into cheap laptops already come dangerously close to violating the Geneva Convention. 8GB is just stupid, even for a Linux system.
If I ever have to use a laptop with 64GB of space, I'm following the Geneva Checklist :3
Even cheap SD cards are larger these days. The smallest SSD you can buy in the UK right now is 250GB.
Flatpak seems to be the best choice for consistency and to have it working straight out of the box. I think Linux currently needs this because we're getting a lot less tech-savvy Linux users nowadays. Don't get me wrong; package managers should still be used, but how are we going to get people to change if they run into package conflicts or accidentally uninstall a wrong package?
And universal compatability. One repo, for all distros. That's a big plus too!
You hate people who spend hundreds of ours of their free time developing software, who then release that software for free, under no obligation to you or anyone else, and your reasoning is because they provide it in a packaging solution you don't find ideal?
Maybe fuck off and write your own software.
So maybe use Debian and compile the app yourself instead? The Dev made something free with their time, use your time to make it work for you.
"maybe a software being excessively bloated isn't a good thing"
"just buy more storage bro"
B*tch. i live in a third world country, with limited internet and data plan, and also is still a student. If i can just buy more storage and better hardware i will.
Personally I do like the ideas behind Snap/Flatpak. I think the sandboxing is a huge deal and will improve security going forward.
In a world where space is usually the cheapest and most available hardware on a PC, I tend to agree. That being said, it's the kind of solution that comes from engineers who put the onus on the hardware to make up for their shitty software. Engineers like me.
Why the hell do you only have 8GB? Are you trying to install flatpaks on a smart fridge?
Sort of, actually
I was trying to build a PC just to play internet radio on using Shortwave, and a 30β¬ thin client with 4 1,5Ghz cores and no active cooling, 4 gigs of ram and an 8gb ssd were more than enough for that
For your use case, building from source might be more practical.
Yeah flatpak won't work on my Nokia 3310 either, what a shit software...
Edit: if you upvoted this comment, your kneecaps pop when you pick up things from the ground
There's very good reasons that app developers focus on flatpaks, which mostly revolves around how incredibly terrible the experience is creating native packages for each distro and each release version of those various distros.
Flatpak used to be problematic, but even a loud hater of Flatpak, Richard Brown of openSUSE, now lauds Flatpak as an excellent solution after his criticisms were addressed.
Another missed occasion to have taken a screenshot. There's gnome-screenshot, scrot, your DE's integrated tool and so many others to choose from, you can do it!
That sort of shit makes me hate the modern internet. (Also screenshots are cleaner and therefore compress better since you seem to care (rightfully) about storage space.)
Yeah but if youre using a lemmy app on your phone its significantly faster to just use your phone camera rather than having to share/transfer the file over somehow, or sign into lemmy on your pc. Im not saying you're wrong, but i get why someone wouldn't care for a quick throwaway post. Also storage then isnt an issue on the PC at all because the image is only on the phone.
Alternatively though, if an app has KDE library dependencies for example, it's kinda nice to not have to install a whole other desktop system wide.
Cut the crap. Flatpak uses hardlink from repo where file names are jash of the file itself. The chance of duplication is exactly same as that of duplicate files of same name in same directory.
Flatpak repo grows because we trade uncertainty over abi stability with installing all needed versions of libraries. For abi incompatible builds you could already do that in many distros (versioned soname) but to a lesser extent.
Also I usually do not install nvidia GL with flatpaks that I won't run on nvidia on hybrid gpu laptops anyway for energy reasons.
Yeah, I'm not a fan of flatpak for my usage, but this isn't a great argument against it.
I'd rather someone "only" release on flatpak if that's the simplest way they can support Linux compared to no support at all.
Oh lmao, I decided to look into this. https://github.com/flathub/com.ktechpit.torrhunt/blob/master/com.ktechpit.torrhunt.yaml
Looks like it just downloads the .snap package (directly from Canonical's website) and extracts it. It's also, of course, completely closed source so who knows what it's doing when it's running.
Lol kinda wild to me seeing flatpak hate as a new Linux user (running fedora with kde). Flatpaks have just worked for me and it's been fantastic
If you're new to Linux, then your probably not familiar with the full Linux community yet. Much like in real life, online Linux spaces tend to have a very loud minority of conservatives who hate progress.
Usually you'll see them hating on things like systemd, 64bit architectures, containers, new packaging systems (like Flatpak), immutable and experimental distros (like Nix), Wayland, "bloated" desktops like KDE or Gnome, and much more.
And just like in real life, the antidote is to not take another person's word for it. Do your own homework/try things out yourself and arrive at your own conclusions.
did you see those little < in front of the download sizes? org.kde.KStyle.Adwaita, org.kdePlatform.Locale, org.kde.Platform and com.ktechpit.torrhunt won't be fully downloaded as those are possibly already installed and can be reused, so in the best case you only download org.freedesktop.Platform.GL.nvidia-570-86-16 fully.
I'm coming back to Linux after a hiatus. I've spent most of my time with the Debian flavors. Not afraid of the command line, but not an expert either.
I'm trying out Bluefin right now, semi-immutable atomic os based on silverblue, based on Fedora.
On normal installs, I usually change and install enough stuff, that when it comes time to upgrade to the next os version, I'm sometimes not able to without introducing instability or it outright falling. The former more common than the latter.
Let's just say I got used to reinstalling and starting from scratch, especially if I experimented too hard and broke something big like my DE or drivers.
So with bluefin I'm hoping to leave everything that's core, alone. I'm trying to rely on flatpaks, app images, and distrobox for everything else.
So far so successful. I've only got a couple minor gripes, some limitations of flatpaks. But I've also only been at it for like a week, so we'll see.
I guess my point is, flatpaks have a place π€·ββοΈ
I habe a PC with an 8gb SSD
Are you using a first gen eeePC?
I think I bought one of those for 40β¬, 12 years ago.
its barely legible but isnt that still less than a gb? where you you even get an 8gb ssd? why would you use one outside of some specialized embedded application that shouldn't even have a desktop interface? and even then why not something lighter than kde or gnome
It's very efficient for what it does. and your programs will actually open.
Yes absolutely true, but also no.
https://gitlab.com/TheEvilSkeleton/flatpak-dedup-checker
For me it is 32GB of data with deduplication, and only like 25GB with BTRFS compression.
So while still way too much, not really a problem if you have a reasonable 50mbits+ internet connection and a 200GB+ SSD
There should still be waay more force. There should only be one runtime (FDO) and KDE and GNOME being extensions to that. Not sure if these perfectly dedupe though
Flatpak is love, flatpak is life.
I liked Snaps and Flatpaks fine when I first started using Linux, and the distro I was on treated them the same as software in the repo, but I eventually started to avoid them because of the space they take up, and because I got tired of constantly having to mess around with permissions to try to get things working. Now, if something isn't available in rpm, I use AppImage or a tarball, or compile it myself.
flatpak install/update <package name> --no-related
there problem solved
Just build from source