Comradeship // Freechat

how “using ‘male’ and ‘female’ to refer to men and women as if they’re animals” is a terminology that radical feminists would otherwise get excused for?

Most radfems are also against trans people. Does this automatically give you the excuse to start being transphobic too? Despite that neither we use dehumanizing terms like "male" and "female"; nor do we believe in transphobic nonsense, so what's your excuse here?

Of course, you weren't being transphobic back in the thread but I mentioned this because, as you say, "radfems use it so it's okay if I use it too".

What, do you think we treat radfems like comrades or something? Lmfao no. Most of them can go to hell like their libfem counterparts.

When did this place become so lib

It's not "lib" to see women as something more than what you imagine women to be (merely just a pre-programmed set of behaviors without any differences or chances of growth, improvements or changes whatsoever).

Sure, some could have a few traits as mentioned above (only human after all, and some humans are scummy regardless of gender); but to say all women are like that is straight up falling towards Incel/MGTOW territory.

traditional views like monogamy instead of promiscuity are better

Very, very interesting how rather than using polygamy, you used promiscuity though. 🙂

And besides...

a woman having multiple boyfriends and being a social player, which is very common today in the dating scene

So fucking what? You men can get away with bedding lots of women and society barely bats an eye. It's only when women do the same that you guys start seething. What, do you also believe in manospherical nonsenses like how virgin women are "magical" and that a "player" woman is just "used and dried up"?

social code being different for men and women

Are these set in stone, huh? So much for being a fucking leftist if you believe in this regressing shit.

What, did you had like bad experiences with women in the past that made you develop these thoughts? Or is it the fact that you got exposed to misogynist youtubers (as a kid)? I know they are extremely popular on the subcontinent, living there myself.

men are not an unified front that plans things behind womens backs, similarly, some random woman you see on the street is not conspiring against you specifically

you should have a social codes for

• people your romantically interested in
• family
• everyone else

thats marginally less weird

monogamy and poligamy are both social contracts all participants must agree on, both are morally neutral

that dominance/submission thing i think its called power play, you can read about it if you want to, but its not a thing a majority of people will agree with you about it being necesary for relationships

I think you have formed a view/impression of dating and women that does not correspond to reality. Either your sample size of personal experiences is very small and skewed or else you have formed your views based on misinformation and myths that are spread in certain online spaces. I think you just need more real world experience and more contact to real people as you have formed a picture of an entire gender that is simply (at least where i live - i admit there could be cultural differences in other countries that i myself have not experienced) not accurate.

Imo you are committing an idealist error. As a Marxist and thus a materialist you must investigate before speaking on a subject. From what you wrote i assume you are still quite young, and i think your views will change once you have had some actual experience (which you admit you lack) with relationships and people of the opposite gender. Until then try not to engage in so much stereotyping, you may not intend it that way but it comes off as quite rude. And listen to people here who have had a bit more life experience with or as women. Be a bit more humble and accept that you still have a lot to learn.

Where did you get your ideas about how dating works? Also, you mentioned that some conservative/centrist dating advice has value. What takeaways did you get from them that you found valuable?

When did this place become so lib, that people were straight up told to “change your ways before you end up ruining a poor girl’s life”, or how “using ‘male’ and ‘female’ to refer to men and women as if they’re animals” is a terminology that radical feminists would otherwise get excused for? What are these assumed ideas I have that are so batshit crazy, compared to the kinds of values that hardcore masculinity gurus, Tate fans, incels/femcels hold? And what is the defined threshold expected for this place to accommodate people?

Some people did take offense and try to shut you down instead of engage in dialogue, but at least half of the people replying to you in that thread were engaging with you in what seemed to be good faith.

Why is polygamy (or in your words promiscuity) inherently worse than monogamy?

As long as it is acknowledged and agreed upon by everyone involved, there should be no issue. The only problem comes when one person thinks it's monogamy and the other breaks that trust.

The social player thing is not just a woman problem, in fact I'd say it's worse coming from men. As another commenter said, men do that shit all the time and only when women start to engage in similar behaviors does it become a problem. I don't think there's anything wrong with holding certain values for yourself, I myself could never be a social "player" (meaning casually sleeping around, if I'm interpreting that right) and am not interested in anyone who is, but that doesn't give you or me the right to pretend we're morally superior in that regard. I guess the only time I'd feel comfortable shitting on someone is if they're sleeping around while their partner is unaware. But that could just be trauma on my part, someone educate me if I'm wrong lol.

Anyways, I really suggest you take the time to read what some of our comrades here are recommending and digest/think where these thoughts are coming from.

going on a date just to get free food under capitalism is wealth redistribution. a woman's gotta eat and we make less money

Before I start off, I want to tell that it is true that I am a cis het male human that holds monogamist views with the mildest of traditional takes.

This would mostly be fine if you held them for yourself but it's immediately clear from your writing that you don't hold them only for yourself but you hold those positions as normative and when you communicate you impose that position on the world. I like monogamy for myself. What I don't do is say that monogamy is inherently better, or that it is better for society, or that it ought to be the norm because it leads to better outcomes. This is important for you to understand because it underlies a lot of the criticism you are receiving. You're allowed to believe things about yourself. It's when you apply these beliefs to others that you run into problems.

My mindset at the core is unapologetically survivalist, independent and masculine

Having masculinity at your core is a red flag. I've been a cis man my whole life and I don't feel the need to establish masculinity as part of my core mindset. I don't even think masculinity is a real thing, I think it's a social construct that has a history, that is to say, it's a trope or a meme. Fish don't have a core mindset of fishyness. But for historical reasons men and women have concepts of what it means to manly and womanly. But when you look globally, you can see there are similarities and difference between these cultures on what they consider manly and womanly. And when you look at the similarities, they are usually the similarities that go along with reinforcing structures of oppression and the rest is just accidental historical window dressing.

I have also been chivalrous with women, and have been inclusive of the non binary communities.

This does not make you not misogynistic, just like having a black friend doesn't make you not racist. Also, the idea that being chivalrous is somehow not misogynistic is completely mistaken. Chivalry is literally derived from the word for knight, and we can pretty clearly see how the entire of medieval European society was misogynistic and how the knights, warriors with power, title, and sometimes even land, would be part and parcel of the oppression of women. Being chivalrous is not respecting women but rather having deep-seated oppressive beliefs about women and then respecting your own false beliefs more than actually respecting women.

I want to know what is so misogynistic about traditional views like monogamy instead of promiscuity are better

Monogamy is found throughout the animal world, as is polygamy. Neither is better or worse. The belief that one is generally better or worse is problematic. Believing it for yourself, whether you personally prefer your relationship to be one way or another, is not problematic. Believing everyone in the world is playing in your ethical framework is the problem. Believing monogamy is better than polygamy is generally regarded as misogynistic because isolating women into the private home on pain of losing their livelihood is a form of oppression. It's traditional because traditionally women have been oppressed in society, not being allowed medical treatment without their husband's approval, not being allowed a bank account, not being allowed to own property, not being allowed to socialize without male supervision, not being allowed to vote, not being allowed to live alone, not being allowed to have woman roommates. Etc. Monogamy, traditionally, is misogynistic.

I want to know what is so misogynistic about traditional views like social code being different for men and women

This is factually true and there is nothing misogynistic about this observation. Your problem arises when you see this and say "a ha! here is evidence that men and women are metaphysically different and that their social roles are good and proper". When non-misogynists see these social code differences, they say "it is what is because of history and in the future maybe it will change". When people with liberatory politics see these differences, they say "let us find the causes for these differences and let us change society so that these differences may be erased".

I want to know what is so misogynistic about traditional views like women often dating for free food

This isn't a traditional view. This is a false belief. No one has ever dated me for free food. No one I know has I ever dated anyone for free food. No one I know has ever talked about their friends dating someone for free food. From my experience of media, the only people who ever make this claim are misogynist men and the women who take advantage of them. The number of women who take advantage of them is statistically tiny in the grand scheme of things. Your actions and beliefs should not be influenced by the existence of this tiny portion of women. Further, you should examine the reason that the small number of women who do engage in those behaviors do so. What you'll find is systemic misogynistic oppression.

I want to know what is so misogynistic about traditional views like Western feminism not being a true representation of feminism, and how much it currently harms mainly men, and creating polarisation between both sexes

Also not a traditional view. This is a full on reactionary view. Feminism does not harm men. Feminism does not create polarization between the sexes. The polarization between men and women is quite literally the history of class society for millennia. Just go look at history and find for me a time when men and women did not relate in a polarized power dynamic. Men owned women. Men owned multiple women. Men took the labor from women and sold it. Men **** women and sold their children. These things were protected by law. They were practiced in all class societies. They always subordinated women to men. Feminism seeks to fix this and there is simply no comparison between feminism's effect on men and the historical and contemporary oppression of women. The fact that you don't understand this is itself a representation of social misogyny manifesting through you. You are replicating misogyny even if you don't understand it.

I want to know what is so misogynistic about traditional views psychology of dominance and submission in relationships factoring into the stability of any long term relationships, including marriage

You don't see what's so misogynistic about believing that men must dominate women to establish a long-term relationship? Really? Come on now. Just write it down on paper. You believe that in order for a long-term relationship between a man and a women to be stable, the man must psychologically and physically dominate the woman and the woman must submit to the man. That in and of itself is quite misogynistic, but I bet you can do worse. Try to explain why this is true and you'll see that you believe that the woman will leave the man because the woman is not interested in the long-term relationship but the man is. You can just reconcile that right away and say that the woman must be dominated against her interest to satisfy the interest of the man and leave it there. But I'm sure if you keep going you'll come up with more and more repulsive statements that even you should be able to understand as misogynistic.

What are these assumed ideas I have that are so batshit crazy, compared to the kinds of values that hardcore masculinity gurus, Tate fans, incels/femcels hold? And what is the defined threshold expected for this place to accommodate people?

You are being told what the problem is. The threshold is that you accept the criticism and put in the effort to understand how your beliefs harm people and are part of a larger system of oppression. If you don't put in that effort, you don't belong here.