Can people stop pretending like this movement is just a media manufactured story now? The refusal to look at the whole picture is astonishing.
this post was submitted on 12 Jul 2024
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Thank you. In fact, polls have shown that, after the debate, there was little to no change in support among voters. I'm not entirely sure what's going on here.
Frankly, aside from his weak position on Israel, my support for Biden has grown significantly in recent months. He was absolutely right yesterday - if his job performance were weak, he'd have reason to consider dropping out. He's very likely the best world leader in recent times.
No president is going to be perfect - ever. I'll take a shitty debate performance and gaffes and all in exchange for what the guy has done and will do for this country.
It's not about Biden's track record. It's about his ability going forward to run a very taxing campaign against a literal fascist while also performing the duties of the presidency.
And the likely answer to that is "Not nearly as energetically as he needs to for me to not be playing Russian roulette the night of election day".
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Honestly, donors pulling money is the only way Biden will drop out.
It might just turn me into a Biden supporter*, I hate how much influence rich fucks have on our politics
*I was/am going to vote for him or whoever the Democratic nominee is anyway, but I have always thought Joe Biden was a racist-rehabilitating credit card company loving piece of crap and take every opportunity I can to point out that I think the Democratic party needs to do way better than this, but the whole reason we got stuck with President Biden in the first place is because of big money donors like this who think they know better than everyone else
Wait the donors acknowledging they were dumb to stuck us with him is the reason you may turn into a supporter?
Thats some logic
What the donors and the party need to acknowledge is that letting donors rig our party in favor of their own preferences kills our voters' enthusiasm and keeps them home. This shouldn't be happening because Rob Reiner and George Clooney suddenly had a change of heart, if this was going to happen it should have happened months ago when Biden's approval ratings were already in the toilet, or when the college student voters we need to be campaign volunteers were protesting Palestinian genocide, or any one of a dozen other moments.
Well the Dems care more about cash than voters
He needs to step down. I fought this for a while, but he's lost the confidence of his party, and you can't come back from that. Not in a few short months. Any path forward for Biden from here will be a monumental struggle to get the support needed to beat Trump.
Who is the best replacement and how do we choose?
EDIT: It was a collective "We," people. As in, all of us who aren't fascists. I'm well aware of how the democratic party chooses candidates.
Harris is the obvious choice, though I would be thrilled if it went to someone else. The DNC, unfortunately, will have to discuss amongst the delegates who will get the final nod. What's important is that we have unity going forward - which is one of the reasons why it's so important for Biden to step down and get onboard with this.
Man, if only they had given us a real primary 🙄
Yeah. Or rather, Biden shouldn't have announced he was running for a second term, since as soon as he announced, any serious contenders cooled their ambitions. I understand that you don't get into politics without a little bit of an ego problem, but it really fucked us.
He could full out resign, putting Harris in office and be able to appoint a new VP that inspires more confidence than Harris. Could satisfy party brass who want to control the appointment for getting Biden out.
Or he could drop out of the race and endorse Harris at an open convention which would be more democratic.
Hold a national primary over the next month.
people want to replace biden because they don't think he can win the election, not because they want harris as president
why would biden saying "no totally trust me guys i'll step down for harris after i've won" make him any more likely to win, especially after he already told the world he'd be a one-term president?
I think they were suggesting that he resign before the election, and Harris chooses a new VP
The problem is the convention is happening after the ballot deadline in Ohio, which has historically been waived by the Ohio legislature for both parties, but which has not this year with Republicans in charge. That's why there was going to get a virtual roll call before the convention to nominate Biden. There needs to be a nominee solidified and nominated before the convention or risk having no Democratic candidate for president on the Ohio ballot
That makes too much sense so it will never happen. My vote is for a “Thunderdome Convention.” And we all know Buttigieg would wipe the floor with his Gramsci quotes.
I have to say : I think AOC is FAR more electable right now than Harris. And we definitely need the most electable person we can find.
If the DNC doesn't like Sanders - enough that they manipulated his defeat to Clinton - just how receptive do you think they are to AOC being their candidate?
Harris is the only candidate who would be able to access all the money the Biden campaign has already. Anyone else would start from scratch
Which is why Harris needs to be onboard too. And, unfortunately, one of several reasons why she's the most likely candidate.
The issue is contribution limits and what it can be spent on. Harris in control of the money, but not a candidate, means $5k goes to the new candidate and the remaining hundreds of millions become an outside funding entity. That can't pay for staff's salaries or do other sorts of direct spending. It's not an insurmountable hurdle, but it is a pretty meaningful concern. On the plus side, people's donation limits would be reset.
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I’m subscribed to DNC donor lists and get texts 3, sometimes 4 times a day for donations. Lately, I’ve been getting surveys about Biden’s performance.
Today, I got a survey asking if I would support Kamala Harris. The entire survey was about Harris. Not sure if that means anything, but it was unexpected. I said I would support her btw, she would enrage Trump.
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I'm not opposed to the idea of a contested convention. The risks today aren't what they were in 1968, and the internet mediasphere makes that kind of spectacle really valuable for generating high levels of media coverage. I think a 4-day contest that resulted in one person coming out on top would do a lot to bring disengaged voters into the conversation. Whether we like it or not, politics are all about showmanship, and there's value in generating buzz and anticipation.
So… I don’t disagree, and a contested convention (after Biden agreeing to release his delegates saying that he’d love to re-win the nomination but recognizes that the complaints are valid and wants what’s best for the Democrats as a whole) sounds like not a bad strategy.
There’s one pretty chilling thing though: How difficult to do think it would be for a Russian influence operation, or a GOP one working with a few friendly players in local politics / law enforcement in Chicago, to create a giant violent shit show of cops assaulting protestors and creating the exact types of events that will overshadow anything good that comes out of the convention and turn off a whole bunch of left wing people, because they can’t tell the difference between the Chicago cops doing something and the Democratic Party doing that same thing, if it happens at the convention?
I don’t think it would be difficult at all. And that’s before even adding in whatever any boogaloo people who want to show up might do.
I think the DNC could easily be where the fighting in the streets fireworks that continue into November get started for real, and in a way that depresses Democratic voter turnout a lot more than the debate did.
How difficult to do think it would be for a Russian influence operation
That is the biggest worry rn, esp after The Guardian just reported today there was massive "coordinated networks of accounts spreading disinformation (that) 'flooded' social media in France, Germany and Italy before the elections to the European parliament."
Yikes. I hadn't even thought about the possibility of violence. Maybe the fact that they've got a slightly better handle on these clandestine operations now than they did in 2016 will help with the Russian ops. I think the risk of right-wing agitators provoking a violent clash is higher, to be perfectly honest. They'll certainly have to take security very seriously if this is the path they choose.
Man I fuckin hope so. Their efforts on Lemmy are just kind of comical, but that’s because those are the 2-ruble-a-day clowns sitting in a big cube farm somewhere. The real pros are perfectly capable of cultivating an online friendship with some armed right-wing loons in or out of the CPD, and nudging things along very effectively in a terrifying direction, I think.
The risks today aren't what they were in 1968
Are you saying there's less risk now than 68? Because, if you weren't aware, we are on the cusp of literally losing the Republic.
No. I'm saying the risks of a contested convention turning sour are not what they were in 1968 when this happened.
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Why are we still pretending that it's our choice?
We don't choose - the DNC does.
the choice of a nominee is party business — not state law, not federal law, and not constitutional law.
https://www.factcheck.org/2024/07/qa-how-biden-can-be-replaced-as-the-democratic-nominee/
Lighting round debate showdown at the convention, it’s gonna be great!
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People are really missing the point intentionally, it isn't about Biden's Ability to govern in the next presidential Term, but about his ability to convince the swing voters about that, and on that front he is failing, and keeps falling in polls after every public event, he is 6 points behind Trump in most swing States
I think it is about both, candidly. Getting elected is priority one, but being able to effectively govern would be a pretty huge bonus, and that expectation is likely to influence voters.
Oh god, best of luck to you guys from Europe. I hope whoever opposes him is able to beat Trump.
Given how many people I know who dislike Trump but aren't voting for Biden - we're fucked.
I directly expressed the full breadth of insight, heartfelt perspectives and conclusions about the path forward
You wanna share that path forward with the rest of us?
To me, the issue is much more “what are we gonna do instead” than it is “naw man Biden totally isn’t old / it’s not a problem that he is”
Now would be an excellent time to showcase organizational skills and leadership to propose a meaningful plan and execute it dutifully, exhibiting a capable governing party for all to see.
Unfortunately, Jeffries’ big donor puppeteers haven’t thought that far ahead.
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