this post was submitted on 30 Aug 2024
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It feels like Harris has to run a damn near flawless campaign just to BARELY beat this guy. Yeah you can bring up the current state of the country, but Trump mishandled COVID, there were over 200k deaths, BLM protest and was 2x impeached. And yet, Joe Biden BARELY beat him.

Trump is a convicted felon, liable sexual predator, caused an insurrection on the Capitol Hill, tried to steal the 2020 election (find me 11,000 votes), constantly kisses Russia’s ass, has more pending court cases and gets sentenced next month and overall has been the main driving factor in America’s division.

Yet, this race is STILL either 50/50 or a slight tilt (Harris leads the polling aggregate right now). Harris gets destroyed by the corporate media for almost anything, yet Trump is still lying and saying the most outlandish shit and nobody cares.

Why does it feel standards are much higher for Harris than Trump?

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[–] dhork@lemmy.world 333 points 2 months ago (4 children)

Because too many people treat politics like a sporting event. You root for your team no matter what, and against the other team. You have to do it this way, because if the other side wins that means your side loses.

So there are too many people who view Trump as "Their Guy", and are "rooting" for him. Anything they hear that might portray Trump in a negative light (like a criminal trial, for instance) must be the Other Side trying to cheat to win unfairly.

I remind people that Roger Ailes was Nixon's media consultant, and the lesson he learned from Watergate was that Nixon could have gotten away with it if the media was more sympathetic. He then went on to be the CEO of Fox News. That's no accident. There is a direct line from Nixon to Trump, and Roger Ailes drew it.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 109 points 2 months ago (6 children)

the lesson he learned from Watergate was that Nixon could have gotten away with it if the media was more sympathetic.

Then we got Reagan, Bush, and Trump, and he proved it.

[–] halcyoncmdr@lemmy.world 76 points 2 months ago (1 children)

The media almost singlehandedly bringing Watergate to the average American's attention was why Murdoch created Fox News. It was created specifically so they could force control of the narrative to their advantage.

And then we allowed every other media corporation to be bought and do the same once they saw it worked so well.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 26 points 2 months ago (7 children)

The media almost singlehandedly bringing Watergate to the average American’s attention

If you really get under the hood of Watergate, it had all the fingerprints of a soft coup. Nixon was a shit and made for an easy fall guy, but also Trumpian in his stubbornness and his refusal to go whole hog on the Cold War. Ford toed the line - installing Bush Sr to clean Kennedy's liberals out of the CIA, promoting Greenspan and Rumsfield to the Republican inner circle, and tapping the breaks on our openness with China.

There was no real reason to break into the Watergate given that Nixon was beating McGovern in a landslide. But it did a lot of favors for the movement conservatives like Goldwater and Reagan to get Nixon's ass out on the curb.

The WaPo (a hotbed of spooks even back then) played a big roll in that for a reason. Ffs, Woodward was an agency man going back to his time in Naval Intelligence. He broke Watergate less than a year after joining the paper.

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[–] stinerman@midwest.social 43 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Also white supremacy is a hell of a drug.

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[–] corroded@lemmy.world 187 points 2 months ago (5 children)

The problem isn't that Harris is being held to a higher standard. The problem is that Americans think of elections the same way they think of a sporting match. It's "my team is going to win!" not "I'm going to vote for the candidate that is best aligned with my beliefs." A huge number of the people who are voting Republican are doing so because the Republican party is their "team," and damn it, their team is going to win even if it kills them.

Many years ago, I was discussing politics with a coworker (always a bad idea, but whatever). It went something like this:

"So, you don't think the less-fortunate should be able to afford medical care?" "No, of course not, everyone should be able to see a doctor."

"You don't think gay people should be allowed to marry?" "I'm not gay, but they can do whatever makes them happy."

"You support the war in Iraq, then?" "I support our troops, but the war is kind of a waste."

"We definitely should legalize weed, right?" "Um, I'd smoke it if I didn't get drug tested."

"So why are you voting Republican, then?" "My family is Republican; we always do."

[–] nifty@lemmy.world 41 points 2 months ago (3 children)

“So why are you voting Republican, then?” “My family is Republican; we always do.”

Republican politicians would eat this person and their family if it ever came to it

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[–] tlou3please@lemmy.world 34 points 2 months ago (2 children)

As an outsider looking in, I've seen a lot of footage of rallies and events (on both sides) that are just absolutely crazy to me. Almost dystopian. People with painted faces, all kinds of merch, hollering and shouting and cheering like it's the X Factor or a rock concert or something. You see people being interviewed outside the events and it's like a festival in the background. It's really, really bizarre. We have problems with our politics here too but not like that. I can't believe that all of those people are ACTUALLY that passionate about any policies themselves, it's just vague culture wars nonsense with a bizarre personality contest as a proxy for it.

As I say, I'm not trying to act superior. My country has its share of problems too, just a very different sort.

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[–] aStonedSanta@lemm.ee 32 points 2 months ago

We call this indoctrination. Cult. And fucking sheep. Lmao

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[–] neidu2@feddit.nl 134 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Because a cult leader is automatically the purest one can be and needs no scrutiny.

[–] BadmanDan@lemmy.world 39 points 2 months ago (4 children)

I understand the MAGA cult, but do moderates not see this?

[–] neidu2@feddit.nl 43 points 2 months ago (1 children)

There the opposite is true. They already know that the other guy is a villain. Their candidate will have to prove themselves not to be.

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[–] Professorozone@lemmy.world 118 points 2 months ago (11 children)

Can't believe you are asking this now. In the 70s, I don't believe any of these yokels would have been elected. Lauren Beaubert, Marjorie Taylor Greene, Trump, they've all done things and said things that are so far over the line, it isn't even funny. Nixon? Please, he would be small potatoes today.

Why? Gerrymandering. Social Media. Lack of critical thinking skills. A sense of hopelessness. Apathy. Billionaire brainwashing. The list goes on. The strange thing is, conservatives want to go back to the way things were. For them that means when women had to go to back alleys to get abortions, when gays were stoned, when blacks weren't allowed to vote. For me it means when people didn't justify these ridiculous notions, but instead just said, "No!"

[–] lurch@sh.itjust.works 73 points 2 months ago (6 children)

conservatives aren't conservative any more. they are radically backwards. the things they want are so far back, they don't even want democracy any more. i don't really have a say in that, but maybe the time has come to stop calling them conservative.

[–] shalafi@lemmy.world 25 points 2 months ago (6 children)

I'm conservative vs. most of lemmy and damned if I'll vote anything but straight D right down to dogcatcher. I wouldn't vote for an R even if I liked them! The message must be sent. Even if it's a loss, your vote ends up as a percentage on a spreadsheet. It is still seen.

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[–] Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 72 points 2 months ago

Because the media are largely in the hands of the oligarchy that will stop at nothing to get another tax cut.

[–] pseudonym@monyet.cc 72 points 2 months ago (13 children)

All those things you said against Trump are actually working in his favor. His base sees it as persecution of their chosen one.

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[–] Guy_Fieris_Hair@lemmy.world 70 points 2 months ago (2 children)

You must be young. Because Republicans will vote for a criminal before they vote for "communism". Because the Republicans attempt to destroy the educational system to keep people dumb enough to vote for them has worked. Because dispite the corporate media pandering and acting like they want Harris Because that's what their viewers want, their billionaire owners don't. They want the republican led centrist enabled tax breaks on their money. Harris has also brought in the progressives which have zero tolerance for the centrist mindset. She is in a situation where she has to dance a dance of trying to reel in the progressives even though they are going to throw a fit when she panders to the centrists and the corporate overlords.

The system is made and controlled by the billionaires. No hard progressive that doesn't play the game a little is going to get elected... right now. They will destroy anyone that threatens their billions. Everytime she goes a little too hard left they throw a fit.

Welcome to end stage capitalism.

[–] JusticeForPorygon@lemmy.world 28 points 2 months ago (3 children)

No hard progressive that doesn't play the game a little is going to get elected...

Poor Bernie...

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[–] ChonkyOwlbear@lemmy.world 68 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Can you imagine a woman or a black man (let alone a black woman) running for president while being three-times divorced with kids from multiple partners and having cheated multiple times on top of that? Even if they were rich like Trump, it would never fly.

[–] BadmanDan@lemmy.world 22 points 2 months ago (2 children)

Obama’s political career would’ve ended the second “grab em by the p****” got leaked.

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[–] transientpunk@sh.itjust.works 22 points 2 months ago

You forgot to add convicted felon

[–] JasonDJ@lemmy.zip 50 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (5 children)

Trump is an outrage machine, and we have a media that deals in an economy of outrage.

Trump gets outrage. Outrage gets clicks. Clicks get money. It's a pretty simple chain to follow.

We need to wake up and realize that a profit-driven instantaneous news system that leverages strong emotions is not good for anybody. Truth is subjective nowadays, (always has been, really, but it's especially evident in the current media climate) and all that matters is getting information and narratives (not necessarily facts) out and people consuming it (and all the ads embedded with it) there, first, and right now.

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[–] HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club 49 points 2 months ago (1 children)

I feel like a lot of people on Trump's side don't care and all of his issues have been documented in the press. If people cared, he wouldn't be this close.

You also have enough people left of Harris who don't want to hold their collective noses and vote for her. They'll complain about the Overton window shifting right, but won't be a bulwark for keeping it from shifting right. Hell, there are people on Lemmy complaining about political utilitarianism as a reason for voting for Harris and will even complain about Bernie if he says something being done by the Biden administration is good.

[–] acosmichippo@lemmy.world 35 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (2 children)

it's so frustrating. I admit I used to vote green, but the entry of Trump opened my eyes. Things like judge appointments, incremental advances in fighting climate change, and NOT having a seditionist as president are all issues we can't afford to lose on in the next 4 years just for some rhetorical vote for the Green Party.

in a perfect world we'd have ranked choice voting, but we aren't in that world.

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[–] Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world 47 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago)

Because some Democrats have standards, and Republicans don't.

[–] Blackmist@feddit.uk 44 points 2 months ago

I don't believe it's possible for anybody to be held to lower standards than Trump.

It's a good thing she's held to higher standards. I don't want anybody held to his standards running anything.

[–] stebo02@lemmy.dbzer0.com 43 points 2 months ago (5 children)

Because MAGA is the largest cult in the world and they won't believe their great father could do anything wrong...

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[–] WoahWoah@lemmy.world 34 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (1 children)

Because Harris's supporters have standards.

One thing particular to Trump is the percentage of his supporters in polling that support him no matter what. Trump has maintained some of the most sustained, consistent support of any modern political candidate. His base polling numbers basically haven't moved in like 10 years.

Trying to have his VP executed, injecting bleach, porn stars, felonies, treason, domestic use of military, anti-veteran sentiment, belittling the disabled, racist comments, sexist comments, sexual assault, etc., etc., etc. None of that meaningfully moved the needle.

You are not going to "get" Trump on anything like that. If you want him to lose support, he needs to be seen as weak, ineffective, and laughable in the eyes of his supporters. None of the above does that, because that isn't what Trump supporters care about. They care about hurting people they don't like or see as lesser-than. If Trump stops doing that effectively, he will lose support. But, frankly, he's really good at it.

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[–] niktemadur@lemmy.world 33 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (12 children)

Because so many trump voters are low-information, rabid and impervious to fact and/or reason. They will vote orange even if he shoots someone on Fifth Avenue to death, or if there are 32-or-whatever felony indictments/verdicts.

Meanwhile, many potential Democrat voters are also low-information in their own way - impressionable, fickle and with little memory retention, they seem unable to act upon a clear and present danger until it punches them in the goddamned face (and by then of course it's too late), somehow have normalized the orange threat and are easy prey to an algorithm pushing a "both parties are the same" divide-and-conquer propaganda.

The difference between a parasite-laden excrement chip cookie and a raisin oatmeal cookie, "But I wanted chocolate chip! bOtH cOoKiEs ArE tHe SaMe!"

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[–] Buffalox@lemmy.world 31 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (6 children)

USA as a society is mentally ill, where sociopathy is often seen as a virtue. For instance denying poor people health care and food, denying pregnant women with potentially lethal complications the right to abortion. Allowing (white) people to kill (black) people without reason based on stand your ground rules. Refusing stricter gun rules despite countless school shootings. Denying workers a living wage. The list of sociopathy permeating US society goes on and on.

Now I know that despite this, about half the population see the problems. There are also Americans that fight this, and are world class people. But the other half, somehow confuse Trump's sociopathy with strength, and admire him for it. Yes this is how it is in USA, sociopathy is widely not only accepted but admired, people want Trump to hurt people, the poor, emigrants, people of color, LGBT. Many Americans want all these people to suffer, for no other reason than their mere existence. Somehow this is OK to even extend to women in general too! As Trump is clearly a major misogynist.

If you are a normal well functioning person, it's near impossible to grasp that such hate can be this widespread, and Trump is fueling it, and before him Republicans have been fueling it for decades.

This makes all the hateful illegal stuff Trump does nearly irrelevant, people simply don't care, his followers just want to see the people they hate burn. It's not that Trump isn't called out at times, it's just that it doesn't really make a difference.

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[–] BallsandBayonets@lemmings.world 31 points 2 months ago (12 children)

People who would ever consider voting for the Toupee have no standards. No bar, no logic or even thought goes in to who they vote for.

The people who are planning to vote against the Toupee have standards. And the Democratic party has continually failed to meet those standards. And the only time the people have any power to pressure a politician is when they're running for office. Anyone claiming "just vote in the D, then we can focus on getting progress made" is a centrist who is ok being perpetually part of the oppressed class.

Yes, we need to vote against the Toupee, and the GOP in general. We also need a presidential administration who will get progress done. And since the human species has, at best, 30 years left before the majority of the world is uninhabitable, little baby steps won't cut it.

So Harris and the Dems have a high bar. Because the alternative is fascism, or death by climate change.

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[–] rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee 30 points 2 months ago (1 children)

You ever see one of those families where the drug addicted high school dropout gets everything handed to them by the parents but the successful honor student gets beaten because they passed the entrance exam to harvard but didn't pass it good enough?

It's like that.

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[–] IzzyJ@lemmy.world 29 points 2 months ago

Theres several reasons

Part of it is good old fashioned bigotry

A big part of it is the systemic advantage the Electoral College gives Republicans

And of course there's the matter that Traitor Trump voters don't have standards while the rest of us do

[–] SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone 28 points 2 months ago* (last edited 2 months ago) (4 children)

Because the kind of people who run CNN and other staples of traditional media are the same people who covered for people like Jimmy Savile.

Mark Thompson is Chairman and CEO of CNN. Here's some blurbs from his Wikipedia, the Savile one being the most salacious.


In September 2010, Thompson acknowledged some of the BBC's previous political bias, which he said he had witnessed early in his career. He stated: "In the BBC I joined 30 years ago there was, in much of current affairs, in terms of people's personal politics, which were quite vocal, a massive bias to the left". He added: "the organisation did struggle then with impartiality".

Fucking news to me, mate.


Although Thompson departed the BBC before public exposure of the Jimmy Savile sexual abuse scandal and is not noted in the BBC chronology of the unfolding coverage, Thompson faced questions about his role in the events around Savile's actions and BBC coverage of them. According to a New York Times review, Thompson denied knowing of a BBC Newsnight programme on accusations against Savile before it was dropped soon after Savile's death in October 2011.

Literally everyone around Savile is fucking trash.


In a 4 February 2024 investigation by The Guardian, some CNN staff blamed their channel's newly appointed director Mark Thompson for what they described as biased reporting of the Israel–Hamas war. The staff criticized their network's coverage of the war, charging that it had promoted Israeli propaganda, and gave more attention to Israeli suffering, and the Israeli narrative of the war. One staffer claimed that this bias was systematic and institutionalized, as many journalists' stories were forced to be cleared by channel's Jerusalem bureau before publication. Staffers claimed that statements by Hamas and the Palestinian Authority were rarely reported on, while Israeli statements were taken at face value. A CNN spokesperson denied the charges of bias.


That's to say nothing about the pro-Trump head of Discovery (which owns CNN) David Zaslav slobbing this guys knob.

Discovery CEO David Zaslav shared, "I am confident he is exactly the leader we need to take the helm of CNN at this pivotal time."

Thompson was also formerly at the New York Times, another publication that has been swinging to the right. However, if you check out the Lifestyle section of the NYT, you quickly realize why, because it's aimed at rich fucks with a second house in the Hamptons.

It's literally in their short-term-financial-interest to get Trump. They don't give a damn about long-term-interests at all.

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[–] INHALE_VEGETABLES@aussie.zone 27 points 2 months ago (2 children)
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[–] bitjunkie@lemmy.world 26 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Because what passes for journalism these days subsists on engagement metrics, and Harris doesn't say crazy off-the-wall shit every 10 seconds.

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[–] wuphysics87@lemmy.ml 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Trump is more than a candidate. He validates and supports a state of mind. To many, he is a champion of a lifestyle and a way of thinking. That isn't something that is easy to overcome.

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[–] Alwaysnownevernotme@lemmy.world 25 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Kamala proposed a corporate tax hike. They will be pulling out literally All. The. Stops.

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[–] duckduckohno@lemmy.world 24 points 2 months ago (1 children)

It's the same when it comes to any other countries. The right always gets away with corruption because it's expected. Whereas the left has a higher moral standpoint so it is being accused of hypocrisy and things get blown out proportion even if small scale corruption occurs. For example in UK the previous government were giving jobs and contracts to friends and family all the time and nobody cried about it. It became accepted. The new left of centre government comes in and gives a temporary pass to a donor and suddenly it's a huge scandal...

It's the same if you care for the environment and ever took a taxi somewhere, or a vegetarian or vegan and have shoes made out of leather. Sure you are doing better than everyone else to help but you are still the devil and worse than everyone else somehow...

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[–] Hegar@fedia.io 23 points 2 months ago (1 children)

Our electoral system is just shit.

She's way more popular and so are her policies, but having the support of the majority of voters doesn't guarantee victory like it would if we lived in a democracy.

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[–] nexguy@lemmy.world 23 points 2 months ago

Every politician in U.S. history has been held to a higher standards than Trump. And thank God.

[–] linearchaos@lemmy.world 23 points 2 months ago

I'll take racism, sexism, propaganda and capitalism for 500 Alex.

They've got pretty firm control of the business sectors through tax cut agenda. They've got pretty firm control of the farmers for the same. Through fear and propaganda they've got pretty strong control of the poor and some of the educated middle class in the rural areas. A lot of the red states are doing everything they can to impede their education systems. If you keep people from becoming educated there's less competition at the top and a lot more red voters.

All you've got to fight them are the poor and the middle class in the cities and suburbs and the occasional upper class that isn't so self-serving that they're willing to stand on everyone else.

[–] DogPeePoo@lemm.ee 22 points 2 months ago

Because the Billionaire owners of the media— FOX NBC ABC CNN are all conservatives who support project 2025.

They are predominantly white and they want their tax cuts while passing the bill to the plebeians.

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