FORMULA 1 PIRELLI GRAN PREMIO D’ITALIA 2024
Look I don't want to sound like a downer and I'm happy for Charles and all, but it's hard not to have severe frustration at McLaren as your main takeaway from this race. They're being complete idiots and I simply don't understand it. Piastri should not be attacking Norris on lap one, he should protect him. Team orders suck, but you have to be ruthless if you want to be champion. But maybe they just don't care about winning?
I'm at least happy Albon got two good points, even though it was thanks to Magnusson's bone-headed penalty as Haas successfully undercut him. Shame Alonso missed out on a point by 19 hundreds, but AM just don't have the pace right now so can't complain.
Yeah, McLaren is not acting like a front running team at all. I mean they could've easily hung 1 or both cars out there and responded to Ferrari pitting.
As for team orders ... The balance between a far reaching WDC and keeping both drivers happy enough and just getting the WCC, touch call. I don't envy Stella/Brown for having to make it.
I don't see a world where Max doesn't win the WDC, even with these pace differences
It's still possible, but Lando needed to actually capitalise on this weekend. Even the extra three points if they had decided to swap places with Piastri could end up being the decider, never mind the win. I think you're right Verstappen ends up hanging on to the championship, and it will be all due to McLaren incompetence and stubbornness. Such a frustrating season when it should really be a terrific chase to follow. Does my head in.
Yup, squandered chance is the name of the game
I really don’t see how Piastri with the ultimate “#2” driver in Webber as his manager is ever going to roll over and help set a status quo where Lando is set to be #1. It’s something that McLaren through Senna and Prost back in the day knows well and the winner in the end is the driver that takes it all. As an Australian I’m very happy for Piastri to have the balls to assert this, he’s maybe not going to win this WDC but it’s all positive for the future!
Totally agree. It's a bad idea for the team (could lose his talent) and for Oscar to play this game. If it was 10 points between max and Lando? Sure, play wingman. For this? Nah
Awesome race and extremely excited for Charles. But man, until Mclaren are mathematically eliminated, Mclaren should be playing ruthless to get points. These mistakes are embarrassing and it's a shame that these exciting wins keep getting sidetracked by Mclaren strategy
With 8 Grand Prix and 3 Sprints to go Lando would need to outscore Max by 7.75 points on average every remaining race weekend. Considering Red Bull's struggles with their car and competitiveness of Mercedes and Ferrari, just a mix of consistent podiums and wins would give Norris a good shot at WDC. Even today he closed the gap by 8 points, and there's still Singapore and Qatar coming up, so I'm expecting a bigger swing in favour of McLaren. It's baffling they aren't using every opportunity to give Norris every possible point right now. I understand not wanting to strip Piastri of his first win in Hungary, but today their unwillingness to issue team orders cost them easy points.
On the other hand, good for Piastri. Unless McLaren takes a clear stance on prioritizing Lando, Oscar has no reason to act like his ~~doormat~~ number 2 driver. It would be hard for him to shake that reputation, and who knows how the WDC fight will look like in 2025.
Zak said in the pre race show that he has “2 number 1 drivers” so that is how they drive.
Now speculation mode on: I think behind the scenes Piastri’s manager Mark Webber is pulling some serious strings so his driver will not be treated as a number 2 driver…or should I say…Multi21 driver. Webber’s been in that situation and he’ll make very sure it ain’t happening under his watch again.
Yeah, when Oscar overtook Lando today in lap 1 the Austrian commentary was like "that's a Mark Webber move".
McLaren trying to win championships challenge (Impossible)
I think at this point it's clear they don't want to go for the WDC for whatever reason. And with Ferrari not that far behind and them blundering like this again and again, I would not be surprised if they don't win the WCC as well.
And to be a bit sarcastic: I'm sure Lando is happy to have let Oscar pass in Hungary after they told him how important the team is for his chances.
To win the drivers championship, McLaren had to execute 9 perfect races including Monza. We're talking about a team that had 0 perfect races this season. Norris isn't in the fight, the intrigue that the media is creating is purely artificial. Which is sad, because this season is interesting enough without it. There is no need for unreasonable fantasies.
They MUST capitalize as much as possible on any weekend where Max/RB are not strong, such as this one.
In a perfect world, Lando and Oscar would have worked together to defend from Ferrari and secure their 1-2 with Lando at the front. That would have been 17 points to relieve them a bit of this pressure of performing perfectly on all remaining weekends.
Of course we don't know if Charles/Ferrari would have won either way with their strategy. But Oscar gifting Charles a Lap 1 overtake on Lando and both McLarens straining their tyres racing against each other probably didn't hurt Ferrari.
Before today I seriously thought that Lando/McLaren had a chance at WDC, especially with Baku and Singapur still coming up. But as you said, they have shown again and again this season that they can't execute the race weekends necessary for this to happen.
In addition to their repeated strategic blunders, it also feels like they've just never readjusted to the reality that they have a shot at the WDC. It's like they're still in a world where Max is 300 points ahead and they're all "we've got two good drivers, let's let them race!". This season would have been one for the ages had they just fucking capitalised on their pace, but at this rate Max is going to stumble across the line to the most underwhelming Driver's Championship in ages.
In my opinion, McLaren should have "let them race" up until the summer break. After that, support the driver closest to Verstappen. If something unforeseen happens and the "second" driver gets ahead, then full support to him. Simple and clear. Maximize points for the best positioned driver in the WDC and for the team in the WCC.
I still have hopes for Norris taking the WDC, but it will be a tall order. It might come down to fastest lap points even! But he will have to have full support from the team and Piastri.
I would have gone full ruthless points-maximising for Lando even earlier, as it was clear only he would have even a remote shot of catching Max. But you're right, summer break at the latest.
Given McLaren threw away at least three points here (by not swapping positions of Lando and Oscar) it might indeed come down to fastest laps. Which is a pressure it would have been nice to avoid by capitalising better on this race.
Agree, it's like the "Checo will challenge Max for WDC" in 2023 media spin.
The drivers are good, the car is great. The team is not acting like they wanna win the WDC and barely like they wanna win the WCC. They're like surprised to find themselves up in the field
I did not foresee Ferrari winning on strategy (plus Charles excellent tyre management)
I just don't understand McLaren. Remember the drama in Hungary, where Norris had to give up his position to Piastri? But now, papaya rules?
Somehow, Piastri seems bent on not being #2 and it looks like he's got the team behind him. And Norris is such a nice guy he'll just fold and play along.
Piastri is ruthless enough to be WDC, but his racecraft is erratic. Norris is a better allround, quick and can keep his cool. But he's too fucking diplomatic. They need each other to maximize points and not squeeze each other out of the way.
This is all trying in vain to make up for Hungary IMHO. They looked like a laughing stock then, and have only muddied the water since.
I just watched the podium ceremony again after reading F1.com's latest article on the Piastri-Norris matter and the McLaren boys have sour faces: Oscar seems pissed by the fact that he lost to Leclerc simply because his car allowed him to do a one-stopper, and Lando even more so because of the Lap 1 debacle.
Oscar seems pissed by the fact that he lost to Leclerc simply because his car allowed him to do a one-stopper
Oscar overtook Sainz who was on younger tires than Leclerc, and the Mclarens were going faster all race, it's not a surprise that they ran out of tire.
The win was strategy and skill, for once.
Welcome to Formula1 @ Lemmy.world Lemmy's largest community for Formula 1 and related racing series
| Location | Date |
|---|---|
| 🇸🇬 Singapore | 20-22 Sep |
| 🇺🇸 United States | 18-20 Oct |
| 🇲🇽 Mexico | 25-27 Oct |
| 🇧🇷 Brazil | 01-03 Nov |
| 🇺🇸 United States | 21-23 Nov |
| 🇶🇦 Qatar | 29 Nov-01 Dec |
| 🇦🇪 Abu Dhabi | 06-08 Dec |
