There are a lot of workers in different industries that are at risk of silicosis and don't know it. The mentality of "it's just dust, don't be afraid to get a little dirty" will end up killing people.
You're absolutely right, all this old timer "Kids these days are so soft..." B. S. When in reality the young just don't wanna die or be maimed at 30.
Take care of your bodies, kids, it's the only one you get. Don't let corporations run you into the ground and then throw you in the trash. We need to demand better working conditions from our bosses and our elected officials.
"The only one looking out for #1 is you." - My section chief when I was in the Army.
I'll never forget it and I pass it on every chance I get. I've gone as far as shaming some people into wearing knee braces and the like because "what the fuck are you doing, you're gonna fuck it up even worse"
I try anyways... doesn't always work...
Keep up the good work, it might not always work, but the times that it does are priceless.
There are a decent amount of teenagers where I work and I try to pass that idea on to as many as I can. Adults too, of course, but it's really satisfying to be able to catch people while they're young and still have loads of time to protect themselves... From a lot of things.
When running a fireworks show, safety is by far the most important part of the job.
In the safety briefing before we start working in the morning, the one before we load shells, AND the one before we fire the show we remind them that the person most responsible for their safety is themselves. If they do not feel safe about something, anything, do not do it and come to me. I will never shame someone for wearing PPE. I will always be inspired from whatever device or tool they come up with to make the job safer or more comfortable.
Everything can wait while we sort out safety issues.
I try to point out to my coworkers that part of what they're trading for wages is wear and tear on their bodies. Using provided PPE is like getting a raise because you're giving the company less.
My doctor told me recently I should wear a mask everytime I mow the lawn. I was like fuckkkk. It's true though.
My boss has emphysema and asthma, but refuses to wear a mask when doing demolition because "it makes it too hard to breath." I don't understand this mentality.
I don't know an outdoor construction worker that doesn't have some sort of pulmonary disease. Chronic rhinitis at best, mostly COPD, many with also with sleep apnea. And those that smoke on dusty job sites will all die young.
The answer here is simple- regulations with teeth.
Every saw uses water. Every worker wears a mask. Random inspections.
Inspector sees one person without a mask? $1000 fine. One machine with no water hooked up? $5000 fine. 10 people with no masks and 3 machines with no water hooked up? $25,000 fine. Make it clear that there is no fucking around here.
Job site like described in the article? Shut down until problems fixed.
I'd further add personally liability of all supervisors, managers and executives. You run such an operation and cannot prove without a doubt that you instructed for safety, provided the necessary tools and materials and did regulary inspections yourself? You pay for everyones treatment and damages.
Personal liability (piercing the corporate shield) is a really tough nut to crack. That'd also do some outsized harm- think kids college fund raided for settlement money.
That said, I'd be happy to make it a personal crime to, with knowledge of the law, instruct any worker to use a machine without safety equipment and water hookup, or to work without a mask. THAT should be a personal crime, like criminal charges. And you should have to, when hired for any such supervisory position, sign a one-piece thing that has that law laid out so you can't claim you didn't know the law.
In my country (Germany) as an architect or civil engineer you can be held liable, in some cases also as an employee, when deliberately or grossly negligently violating technical rules.
At the end of the day no college fund is more important than peoples lifes, but there exist liability insurance specific to certain jobs. It is similiar to doctors malpractice insurance. Expanding the concept to site supervisors seems reasonable to me.
And of course that must not except the company from liability. It should mainly take effect, when the companies liability cannot cover anymore.
Engineering and architecture are different. It's our job to make sure the things we design bring no harm to people and we have specialized training allowing us to take that responsibility on.
Site supervisors are often tradespeople, and may not even have the authority to direct health and safety measures on their site if corporate sees otherwise. I agree, they have a responsibility to do so, but it must be started from the top with some coercion by strong regulation. Putting liability personally on supervisors just removes it from the company who likely made the decision to forego supplying water because of cost savings.
As a manager of blue collar workers that actually gives a shit about my teams this is the answer unfortunately. Many managers don’t care but will if they’re personally liable.
I think each violation should carry a heftier fine than the last, so each worker without a mask would be a 25% nominal increase.
1 without? $1000 2 without? $1000 + $1250 3 without? $1000 + $1250 + $1562.50 10 without? You're looking at a $42,566.13 fine
You have to have escalations, otherwise violating the regulations becomes a business expense, not a punishment.
Well, in this case I'd say split the difference and make it each incident escalates where an incident #1 = "we caught you, we told you", incident #2 = "we told you yesterday to fix your shit / don't do it again, 2x fine" rinse repeat. Otherwise you run the risk of bankrupting a small business that had all 10 of their workers in violation, and maybe even not making a dent in a large business that only had 1 out of 1000 workers caught in violation
In addition to per-incident escalation, what I could get on board with are scaled fines based on contract / business size. The first incident is still "survivable" for small businesses but will actually have teeth for those larger ones. And then of course if they keep violating, say bye-bye economic viability.
gonna need higher fines than that. Its not some rinky dinky small outfits that are handling fancy counter tops like that.
The fucked up part of this is how preventable it is. Very few folks will take to wearing a mask though, when that's all they need.
Here's the full set of measures recommended:
Workplace safety regulators have recommended a suite of measures including water spraying systems, ventilation and vacuum systems to clear dust, in addition to protective respirators for workers — ones covering the entire face if silica levels in the air are high.
Considering these are likely illegal immigrants working on these countertops, I wouldn't be shocked if their employers refused to supply masks.
or charged them for the basic safety gear out of their already low wage.
False, read the article?
Its more than just masks that are needed and the article makes that very clear.
I have had countertops put in two different times. The first time the crew had a water saw and masks. The second time I was horrified to see the guys cutting the stuff raw without even a paper mask on.
I worked for a few spray-foam insulation companies in my early 20's. I'm just waiting to hear the same thing from spray foam. Half the guys I worked with didn't wear masks most of the time and were just covered in foam all day breathing in the off gassing of fire retardents and blowing agents and other nasty chemicals. I quit because I saw the writing on the wall and my boss hated me for quitting before training my replacement. I told him it wasn't worth my health.
The dumbest thing is the mentality between workers sometimes. "Don't be a pussy" some will say when you ask for masks/goggles/ear plugs/etc but none of them will be there when you eventually get injured or sick. None of them will congratulate you, hand you a tough-guy-trophy and pay your medical bills + pension.
Good call. Hed probably be the type to make fun of you for wearing a mask too, huh?
I did construction very briefly ("briefly" because the company owner quit paying me after a while); companies cut corners every possible place they can, because any safety measures cost time or productivity. Even doing things properly costs time and money that they don't want to spend. Construction is competitive, so they're bidding as low as possible, and promising unrealistic delivery times, and then turning around and expecting their workers to make those deadlines and costs.
You can't fix this without stringent oversight, and criminal prosecution for the owners that are refusing to give workers the correct tools, and follow safety protocols.
I absolutely love the enthusiasm for required regulations in this thread but everyone is missing one critical aspect... illegal workers are probably a huge part of those impacted by this. Many of these "companies" who cut counters work through subcontractors and I bet the majority of these are just a guy with an LLC. I would love to see more numbers on the type of worker/businesses being hit with this illness.
Oh dear God I remember being warned about this in a chem lab because we were using some silica.
Dust/particulates are always bad for the lungs. I don't think there's any exception. Masks with a fitness test need to be provided and specified as PPE for this kind of work, at the very least. The company is unlikely to do so themselves unless legally pressured to.
Edit from my double comment: employers are required to provide functioning, proper PPE to employees per OSHA, and also train them on properly using it. If masks and water hoses aren't already considered required, we need to make sure that gets updated. Force the companies to comply or be sued.
I very recently watched a safety module thing about this for work actually as part of the training requirement.
We hear about machines replacing jobs all the time. Why can't they replace cutting fucking countertops so people don't die in their fucking 20s?
This isn't happening in factories. This is happening in situations where someone is remodeling so none of those guys can afford fancy machinery. They usually cut/fit/sand on site.
So much victim blaming in this thread.
Depends on what you're used to. Some people fight using PPE when they really shouldn't be fighting it. It's a difficult nut to crack since too much force from corporate over stupid safety shit fatigues workers to that kind of shit. Finding the right balance isn't easy.
I've been to a place that does this. Everything was covered in water. It prevents any dust getting in the air. The slab and blades have water spraying over it. I don't think a mask was even necessary. But without water I assume it would be awful.
to debilitate young workers, largely Latino immigrants
in an industry where immigrant workers typically labor in small shops and are often paid in cash
made their rounds at the parking lot of the Home Depot in San Fernando, where laborers in long-sleeve shirts waited for people to drive up and offer them work.
In the effort to be politically correct and not say "illegal immigrants", they prevent the reader from knowing the true extent of the problem.
When an employer is willing to break employment laws related to immigration, they may also be more likely to break other laws, like workplace safety laws. When the employees are illegal immigrants, they're not as able to complain to authorities when their employers are breaking safety laws.
If these workers were actual legal immigrants, they could blow the whistle on their employers. If they were unionized their union could shut down the business until their bosses took their safety seriously. But, because they're illegal immigrants an unethical employer can treat them as disposable -- and, pretty much by definition, anybody who is hiring illegal immigrants is an unethical employer.
The people affected here are largely stone workers. Stone workers used to be extremely powerful. The Freemason fraternal organization started as stone workers who held the secrets of the profession, supervised stoneworker qualifications, controlled their interactions with clients, regulated their interactions with the state, etc. Now, because of the widespread acceptance of illegal immigration, not only are stoneworkers not powerful, they're disposable.
You make a good point about how workers have been played against each other to the disadvantage of all. However, there is a lot of area between illegal immigrants and full citizens who are comfortable bringing their employers to court. Many legal immigrants spend years in situations where being fired or quitting would mean having to leave the country. Depending on what they'd be going back to or what family and life they have built here in the meantime, they may be less free to rock the boat even if they felt confident in the legal system. Even citizens would be unlikely to take a stand without the support of some larger group.
Ironically the virus scare made N95s unobtanium or very expensive for several years there. Gonna guess that didn't help with safety compliance amongst the mostly low-income people doing this kind of work.
That is sad to hear. I live in an area where almost no one wore masks. Even at the hight of the pandemic. Our local pharmacies got a bunch of N95s for free to give away free. There was supposed to be a limit but since no one was using them they would give me a lot of extra. I'm guessing they still have boxes stacked up somewhere.
Its also sad that this could have probably been prevented by using a wet saw with water hooked up. Anyone who has cut stone once without a wet saw walks away knowing they shouldn't have been breathing that.
Sand belongs on the ground and in our chips, not in our lungs.
And a little bit in our burritos.
Welcome to the News community!
Rules:
1. Be civil
Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.
2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.
Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.
3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.
Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.
4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.
Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.
5. Only recent news is allowed.
Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.
6. All posts must be news articles.
No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.
7. No duplicate posts.
If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.
8. Misinformation is prohibited.
Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.
9. No link shorteners.
The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.
10. Don't copy entire article in your post body
For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.