this post was submitted on 12 Apr 2025
94 points (98.0% liked)

BuyFromEU

3265 readers
193 users here now

Welcome to BuyFromEU - A community dedicated to supporting European-made goods and services!

We also invite you to subscribe to:

Logo generated with mistral le chat Banner by Christian Lue on unsplash.com

founded 1 month ago
MODERATORS
 

Let me tell you about the “boycott light”: It is of course difficult to directly eliminate all American products and all American technology from your life. Smartphones are one technology in particular for which there is no real European alternative. And of course, in some cases Amazon is the only place where certain products are available or where certain products are significantly cheaper than elsewhere. Boycotting is hard, but there is a way to hurt them without hurting yourself.

But: the big tech companies live from your “engagement”. The more time you spend on YouTube, TikTok, Twitter, Instagram or Facebook, the more advertising they can show you. And the more profitable you are for these companies. That's why they rely on all these addiction mechanisms, because every minute you spend there is hard cash for the companies. This also applies to the eCommerce giants. PayPal collects a commission for every payment. Visa and Mastercard too. Amazon also takes its cut and so on.

Every minute that you are not surfing Facebook but are on Lemmy, Mastodon, on other websites or even offline is a minute in which your engagement there drops and in which no profitable advertising can be shown to you. You can of course stop using those services completely and delete all accounts, but if that's not possible, a partial boycott is also a good idea. If only one of your friend groups stays on Facebook and you move with the others, that's less time spent there and therefore less profit for Zuckerberg. Your local football group wants to stay on WhatsApp, but you can move your friends to Signal? Less time spend in WhatsApp, KPIs are going down.

And of course it's hard when certain products are significantly cheaper on Amazon than in other stores. But if you compare prices before you buy and then buy many products elsewhere and don't just go for the default Amazon, then that's poison for Bezos pocket. If you simply select the other payment methods for stores and not PayPal by default, that attacks their business model. Does a store only have PayPal? Then you can of course do without the purchase completely, but: If you no longer use PayPal as the default, but only where it is absolutely necessary, then the KPIs at their HQ will be on fire.

This also applies to other digital services: If you no longer use Google Search as your main search, but only as a backup when you haven't found what you want in other search engines, then they will absolutly go nuts at Google HQ. If you use an Android phone but refuse to use the AI and all the cloud services, then that kills their engagement metrics and honestly: it doesn't do you any harm.

So: If you are unable to do a full boycott, a partial boycott is still an effective method of harming certain companies. Try to be as unprofitable as possible for you in your circumstances.

all 40 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] Pirata@lemm.ee 16 points 1 day ago

Yes, this has been my point exactly! People are getting too lost in the sauce, not realising dropping their usage of 100% US products/services, to 50% US products/services, that's already a huge damage to their profits.

Bonus points if the other 50% can become EU consumption, because then you're also enriching our common block. Take your time, reduce your US dependency one app at a time, and you'll be surprised by how quickly you reach 60-80% EU products (where I'm at currently).

The more of us start trying EU only products, the more complete our availability of other products will become. Our own version of Visa/MasterCard is already in development, and hopefully we'll soon have some reliable alternatives to AWS and Azure too.

[–] FortyTwo@lemmy.world 11 points 1 day ago

Very good post, I agree completely! It's easy to let perfect become the enemy of good.

One thing I'd add is that many social media companies sneakily get their trackers added to random web pages or other services you might use, so doing random things on the internet could be included as extra engagement (and it also doesn't require you to be signed up to their service in the first place, though it helps them). In this case their business is the data they collect on your behaviour, even outside of their own services, and the ads they can target to you using this on behalf of other entities who outsource their advertisements. It's quite scary how ubiquitous this is.

I think what OP suggested here is a very good mindset to live by, and it will help a lot. If you wanted to go one step further, you could consider combining this with steps to try and prevent these companies from still harvesting your data when you're not even aware that you're using them, e.g., by blocking such trackers as much as possible.

[–] retrolasered@feddit.uk 27 points 1 day ago (3 children)

Fairphone from netherlands

[–] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

or just, like, buy a second hand phone

pixels are pretty easy to find second hand and you can just unlock the bootloader and slap lineage on them

[–] retrolasered@feddit.uk 6 points 1 day ago

Yes that is true and a good option, but fairphones are also modular and designed for home repair

[–] Routhinator@startrek.website 7 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Super hard to order in Canada unless you find an american distributor, which defeats the point.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@Routhinator @retrolasered I know, I am just a random stranger on the internet, but you can buy them already degoogled with /e/OS here: https://murena.com/products/smartphones/

It comes at a bit of a premium, and it can be quite a wait, but they do ship to Canada directly from France via UPS

Else I would be glad to figure something out with you.

[–] nahostdeutschland@feddit.org 3 points 1 day ago (2 children)
[–] retrolasered@feddit.uk 4 points 1 day ago

Yes does run android but they publish instructions how to install custom rom or you can get one running murena OS which is degoogled. I just run stock android and disable google myself

[–] SrMono@feddit.org 7 points 1 day ago (1 children)
[–] neons@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 day ago (2 children)

No. It has custom ROMs like calyxos that are degoogled but out of the box it itself isn't degoogled.

Source: have installed calyxos on mine because of that reason

[–] F04118F@feddit.nl 10 points 1 day ago (2 children)

You could buy them with /e/OS pre-installed IIRC, at least some model at some point.

[–] retrolasered@feddit.uk 5 points 1 day ago

You are right, /e/ is now named Murena

[–] SrMono@feddit.org 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Kay. Running grapheneOS for that matter. Thought fairphone come cleansed, too… the more you know.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@SrMono @neons Stock is indeed normal Google Android. But they really do make it easy to switch to Calyx or /e/OS and back.

Would love for @WeAreFairphone to also start offering a choice of OS, especially in the current geopolitical climate. #unplugtrump

[–] taketwo@social.tchncs.de 1 points 1 day ago (2 children)

@rraggl @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone
Keep in mind that you can only receive a google ready license for your device if you ship the google services by default.
Any other operating system must be installed by the user after purchase or by some other company that does it for them.
Where is the difference between Fairphone offering a google free OS to install post purchase or supporting the community around E or Calyx to make their version work on Fairphones?

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone And offering the alternative OS would show many consumers that there ARE alternatives out there. Most ordinary people have never even heard about the things we are so casually discussing here.

Many just want to just use the device and wouldn't be able to flash ROMs etc. So many people are perfectly happy and fine if they know how to turn on their computer to watch YT, send mails, write letters and do their budget. We nerds tend to forget that.

[–] taketwo@social.tchncs.de 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

@rraggl @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone
If you want to be able to sell your device with google services, you need to ship that rom by default.
So if Fairphone made a different image without GoogleServices, people would still have to install it on their own.
Your Problem with people that have trouble doing that, won't change a bit.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone why are you so insitent on Google Services? Who needs them? (Really) Have been living without them for 4+ years and everything works just fine.

[–] taketwo@social.tchncs.de 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@rraggl @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone
I am not, but the realityis that other people want to use them or apps relying on them and therefore device manufacturers that want to sell devices outside our little nerd bubble are more or less forced to offer them by default.

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone So basically we are both arguing to make the same point from different angles. 🤣

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone And your point is?

They already do work with Murena. Keep in mind Fairphone is still a very small company, compared to others, with limited resources. They can't do it all on their own. And each Fairphone sold is contributing to the idea there is a way to do things differently than what happens now.

Until things like #jolla or #VollaOS and #ubuntutouch gain significant traction (especially UT needs a revival), they are our best chance.

[–] taketwo@social.tchncs.de 2 points 1 day ago (2 children)

@rraggl @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone You have CustomROMS ranging from Google-Free Android to a complete Linux like PostMarketOS.
What is missing for you?

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone And I completely missed postmarket OS somehow... I read that name occasionally in discussions and dismissed it as yet another Lineage clone and never dug deeper. So yeah, needing awareness is a thing.

Playing with UT on my FP4 at the moment and I really like a lot of what I see, but it really needs some serious TLC. No really workable mail client, browser severily out of date, limited options to sync contacts and calendar. No support for secure messenger

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone Maturity and ease of install for the general consumer.

Like I wrote most of the masses have no clue things can be done differently, that alternatives are even available, what they do etc. and doing it themselves is too complicated for them. Think about your immediate family or friends. Who of them even understands what you are going on about?

Most in my circle look at me a) like I am doing something illegal or like I am b) a paranoid conspiracy nut.

[–] lejapproach@social.anoxinon.de 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (3 children)

@rraggl

One reason for #SailfishOS (Jolla's product) not gaining more traction is that apart from their #JollaC2 you can't simply buy a phone with it installed. And if #fairphone (and #shiftphone for that matter) won't do it until these systems gain more traction we're in a vicious circle. So what we need is an idea to get out of this!

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone

[–] jolladevices@techhub.social 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @rraggl @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone
Hallo it's sad to say but the alternative projects don't take traction because they are small. 🤗
There's not a particular fault or error.

I am running the J-D store since years, and I noticed how in the end these are niche project...

[–] jolladevices@techhub.social 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @rraggl @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone ...the site is offering a ready Xperias (10, 10 ii, 10 iii) and other phones like Volla and Pixels-GrapheneOS.

The main issue is the bad marketing and/or low ADV budget: if people don't know about the project, the will not try it and so on.

[–] jolladevices@techhub.social 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @rraggl @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone ...on Jolla, I see that Jolla Official is finally pushing the JC2 with some proper campaign (on IG/FB for sure).

That's happens only today in 2024/25 🤯
Of course smaller projects/ethical proj will not use any advertising boost... staying small.

@jolladevices

Never heard about the J-D store tbh and I've been using Sailfish OS since the Jolla 1!

Yeah, the only way I see for these projects to gain enough relevance atm is using the momentum from movements like #UnplugTrump

@rraggl @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone And for Jolla: ordered two weeks ago, to see the OS myself. Not a peep since then.

Ultimately all those small companies are underfunded. You need solid systems, good people, processes in place to handle backorders (I can demand will only increase), a team to communicate well. etc to make it really work.

Maybe Odoo chipping in? Just a thought (or daydream) if all those like minded companies could start collaborating on some level...

[–] lejapproach@social.anoxinon.de 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@rraggl

And how are they supposed to get the funds when people don't buy their product because they can't act like the big players?

I seriously doubt this will happen because of the use of a certain ERP solution.

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone Growth is achieved by taking one small step after another. Using systems that are fit for purpose is one.

What they need is money, encouragement and our support and objective feedback where we can give it. If we, the nerds and privacy advocates keep bashing them for such teething issues, this will truly never go anywhere.

With the whole #unplugtrump thing going on that gives more momentum and interest for them. Lets do this together!

[–] lejapproach@social.anoxinon.de 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@rraggl

Exactly! And yet I read more criticism than positive messages even at the Fediverse. Let's support them!

Btw: I've been using Sailfish OS for the last 7-8 years (didn't count 😉). If you need any help, let me know. I will do my best!

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 15 hours ago

@lejapproach @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone I know you will. Thank you. No questions right now as I am still waiting for my C2 to be shipped. Do you use it as a daily driver?

[–] rraggl@mastodon.nl 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

@lejapproach @taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone Not only that. Those privacy first / data sovereign companies are a good idea. Don't get me wrong.

But they still have a LOT of work to do on the logistics and customer service side too.

Ordered a Murena tab. On the site it said in stock, shipping in 2-3 days. Two weeks later I checked in asking for an update, the response took a week.

Ran OOS but no one was notified. Took about 1.5 months to arrive.

@rraggl

Another vicious circle I'm afraid. These companies are too small to have logistics and a customer service that could keep up with the likes of Google, Samsung or Apple. And if people don't support them because of this, they can't grow, meaning they're too small to have logistics ... and so on.

@taketwo @SrMono @neons @WeAreFairphone