Imagine getting outflacked from the left by a normal green socdem when you call yourself a democratic "socialist"
this post was submitted on 13 Sep 2024
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chapotraphouse
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Hot take but.... AOC is absolutely right. What are the greens doing in-between each election cycle? Are they winning down ballot/local elections? Are they organizing demonstrations? No. That loser Jill Stein just runs a failed campaign every 4 years. She's not a comrade, she's a grifter.
Say what you will about AOC or the DSA (I'm sure there is plenty of valid criticism), but at least they win and are executing on a plan to gain power. And while I think similarly of the PSL's electoral strategy as the Greens, at least the PSL does phenomenal organization and activism.
Maybe there's something I'm missing, but I fail to see what material benefits Stein/Greens actually provide. If you're looking for a box to check that isn't D/R, by all means vote for the G. But I don't really see any material reason to donate or promote the Greens.
Why is this a good thing? The Nazis apparently knew how to gain power. Should I support them?
What's the point of congratulating AOC on getting elected if she supports genocide? If you want that, you can vote for the other two parties anyways.
Yes, we know that the USian uniparty wins elections. Why did you put 'at least' there, as if that's somehow a good thing?
Say what you will about the national socialists but at least they win and are executing on a plan to gain power. Also lmao at AOC and DSA in the same sentence in 2024
Stein is mostly a gadfly, but gadflies get attention. The dems have no incentive to court leftist votes if they assume we're too small to make an impact or we'll fall in line no matter what they say. The possibility of the Green party becoming viable is one way to demonstrate that that isn't true. I prefer PSL as well, but it looks like the Greens are marginally better known and currently ahead in ballot access.
As for AOC and the DSA, the latter rescinded its endorsement of the former, so I don't think you can treat them as associated. As for why that endorsement was rescinded, it was because AOC got that power and then refused to use it to advance the DSA's objectives. She executed on a plan to gain power, sure, but she's not putting that power to good use, so I don't know what the lesson is there. It's easier to get power if you submit to the establishment?
I dont see how you can see entrism in a neoliberal party guilty of supporting genocide as a winning strategy, the squad got reduced by 2 member this year and will probably drop more, the DSA has lost like 30k members from their peak and its still bleeding members, The dems have become even more right wing copying policies from trump
As small as the greens or the psl are they have seen more success than the dsa
Yeah, gaining power in service of genocide and the persecution of immigrants
Anything that reduces the power and vote share of the two parties is a material benefit for the working class, even a shitty green party getting a slightly larger share of the vote falls squarely under the harm reduction rubric left libs love to chirp about
Death by a thousand cuts is the best the western left can hope for, and every cut counts
The theory of voting third party is very simple:
Imagine politicians are all grifters, who want to get power and/or parlay revolving door through some deal making inside congress (imagine). If one party ideologically closest to you forces you to eat shit via spoiling votes, you either have to make policy deals or spend your days fighting battles with them (and not making deals to get board membership at some ngo).
The Greens haven't gotten a president but they absolutely do campaign and win at the local level. And PSL isn't on the ballot everywhere so they're the next best option. https://www.gpelections.org/greens-in-office/
Aoc doesn't really build off dsa anymore to be fair. Dsa can't even run it's own budget right. They provided a little extra volunteer power for bernie campaign got a huge influx of people and have been in decline since he dropped out of running for Prez. Dsa is a dead end.
Greens are a waste of time though yes.
Jill Stien is only doing what the Union wanted her to do
Back in the day, the Greens could win small seats and get some good stuff through on a State level. They do seem to have faded from public consciousness after the Bush admin, though.